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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:52:29
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
Yes, I've never taken the time to really know a man. My problem, always too afraid of them, intimidated by their power .. trying to get a feel for myself, and I hope I have one, now. I also hope to someday have a real man in my bed again, or anywhere, outdoors, on the beach, in the rain, in the forest ... I don't care, really. I need to feel skin on skin, stroking and caressing and licking and .. I guess I drew the picture.
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 16:45:50
In reply to Re: Damos, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:51:03
> Afterward is another story... what I should have done, what I wished I hadn't.
Oh yeah, know that story well too. Hope we can both find a place where we don't ever need to feel like this.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:23:53
In reply to caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 16:45:50
> > Afterward is another story... what I should have done, what I wished I hadn't.
>
> Oh yeah, know that story well too. Hope we can both find a place where we don't ever need to feel like this.I hope so too. Because I think sex shouldn't be about following a formula; or about doing things on a list, or not doing particular things. Anything you didn't do today, you can do tomorrow. Anything that didn't feel quite right today can be changed tomorrow, just like any other way of expressing love or appreciation for someone else.
Sex is almost never perfect; it's a work in progress. Every time we do it, it acquires new nuances.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:14:44
> > I can't imagine friendly sex, just friendly like that, I don't know. I don't think I'd be satisfied. Question, Alexandra: can friendly sex also be passionate?
>
> Yes.
> Absolutely.I totally agree. In fact, sometimes friendly sex has been more fulfilling for me than relationship sex.
For me, there's a different dynamic with friendly sex. But it's still an expression of love; it's just a different kind of love.
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
Caraher,
There is so much you so here that's true for me too. I've never thought of any woman other than the one I was with. And when I did have thoughts about it during the day, it was almost always about the next time I would be with that person - not a whole bunch of others.
The sleep thing is interesting because they did actually research it and the act of ejaculating does cause the release of chemicals that make you want to sleep. Pre sleep though my thoughs were pretty much the same as those you expressed and wondering how someone so beautiful could want to be with me like that.
And you're absolutely right about the invisibility of imperfections except that it's true always before, during and after. She is who she is and she's beautiful and perfect just as she is and what is truly attracting me comes from somewhere unexplainable deep inside anyway.
The appreciatiion thing is a hard one. I guess I've never been good at it (or at least don't think I am) but that's about me not feeling like I deserve to be there, not about not appreciating her. More often than not, even when I've felt bad about myself, lookin ginto the eyes of this beautiful person beside me and the though of her having given herself to me in such a way makes me want to cry.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 17:38:07
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » alexandra_k, posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
>In fact, sometimes friendly sex has been more fulfilling for me than relationship sex.
Hmm. I've never had relationship sex.
> For me, there's a different dynamic with friendly sex. But it's still an expression of love; it's just a different kind of love.
Yeah. Thats spot on. It still is an expression of love - just a different kind of love :-)
It's not like I sleep with ALL my male friends either - there has to be an attraction from both sides but no desire for anything more (otherwise it would end badly)
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:39:10
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:14:44
Now you see, I can understand the 'friendly sex' thing and can see how beautiful and wonderful it could be, and I'm glad you could experience that. I get it so totally. Strange.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:36:55
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » alexandra_k, posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
It sounds interesting. Very. I'm having a hard time with the concept. I've never been friends with any men. Or boys either, for that matter. But, it would be nice. Lovely, maybe. I never knew how to be friends with men, but lately I've been really feeling it, the kinship, the human being behind the maleness. Lovely, lovely maleness, the more male, the more lovely. No, no no no that's not even true. Hmm. Because hairy bullish types are out. O-u-t. Unless they have oustanding character. I guess it's like, some men will only be with a blonde, only a blonde really does it for them. As a woman I don't feel badly for having my preferences. Not at all. Hmm. Never knew I had 'em, before now. But I do. I absolutely do.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:39:34
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
I just realized something, Damos, reading your post. You said this,
"She is who she is and she's beautiful and perfect just as she is and what is truly attracting me comes from somewhere unexplainable deep inside anyway"
and I absolutely melted, do you know how beautiful that sounds?
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:46:51
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
I just also realized something important about me, it's about being appreciated, knowing I'm appreciated.
I used to get flowers quite a bit, from men, when I was single. And when you're young, and you're single, that's expected. But when I received them, there was an unspoken message hiding in them .. it was .. "this is okay because we're sleeping together, now", or, "I'm going to push for you to have sex with me, I'm showing you I deserve it" or "Tom did this for his girlfriend, and I'm at least as classy as he is, so here" or something like that. Always a motive, always a reason.. but never, never once was I really that reason, you know? But a friend gave me flowers last week, and I just loved that she found me special enough to do that for me. It made my day, really, literally. I'm learning.. learning to appreciate the intensity of my emotional life, how important it is to me, and other people, too. It's why the down times are so incredibly bad.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 19:11:59
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:36:55
> It sounds interesting. Very. I'm having a hard time with the concept. I've never been friends with any men. Or boys either, for that matter. But, it would be nice.
I wondered about that when you first posted about friendly sex. But you seem to be friends with some men here at babble. Is it so different in real life? And of course you can still flirt with friends… it’s just that they’re basically friends rather than basically potential partners.
> Lovely, lovely maleness, the more male, the more lovely. No, no no no that's not even true. Hmm. Because hairy bullish types are out. O-u-t.
What’s wrong with hairy? I love hairy. I can be attracted to men with very little body hair, but generally I love hair everywhere. I remember (years ago) a new partner took off his shirt and I saw his chest for the first time, and I hadn’t expected it but he was just extremely hairy. What a lovely surprise that was! …. OK, I’m back now…
> Unless they have oustanding character. I guess it's like, some men will only be with a blonde, only a blonde really does it for them. As a woman I don't feel badly for having my preferences. Not at all. Hmm. Never knew I had 'em, before now. But I do. I absolutely do.
Nothing wrong with preferences. The thing to avoid (IMHO) is prejudices. By all means be attracted to dark hair or dark eyes or an athletic physique or a smooth chest or a well-cut suit. But of course we can’t assume that men who fit a certain description are going to be good men. The great thing about men is that they’re so wonderfully various. If we never look at men who diverge from our ‘ideal’ we might well miss out on some really fantastic guys. I reckon we would do well to admire all kinds of men…
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 21:39:06
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Damos, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:46:51
I'm really sorry that's the case Suze. Now see, I love to give them for no reason other than the appreciation I can't always express in words. Never, ever in expectation or to keep up with someone else. Just for the joy I experience through the recipient. It's also why I've taken to sending Thank You cards, and I'm now experiencing a sense of joy in the act of appreciating the other person totally independant of their response. The desire to send flowers to some of my babble friends is pretty simply because I can't always express how very much they mean to me and how much I appreciate their kindness and support. Or just to say, I feel your pain and wanted to do something that was just about who you are to me.
And yet I know my father has never ever bought flowers in his life and it simply wouldn't occur to him.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 22:27:31
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 19:11:59
I haven't found men to be really all that different, amongst themselves. They're pretty much what you see is what you get. It depends, though, on how clearly I'm seeing what I'm getting. :] I have been known to make errors in choosing my men.
heavy sigh.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 22:31:26
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 21:39:06
For your mother, he never bought flowers for your mother? Your mother expected very little for herself, and that's so so sad. I wonder at how much things can be different for people. Maybe she was happy never getting flowers from him. Maybe it didn't matter to her... or maybe she never thought she was worth it? I never thought I was. I felt so disconnected whenever anybody did anything nice for me. I lost many people along the way.
Posted by Tamar on June 7, 2005, at 5:07:17
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Tamar, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 22:27:31
> I haven't found men to be really all that different, amongst themselves. They're pretty much what you see is what you get.
I'm a little surprised. The men I know and like are very different from each other, and most of them have hidden depths!
> It depends, though, on how clearly I'm seeing what I'm getting. :] I have been known to make errors in choosing my men.
Do you find that men think of you in that same way? That they think "Susan47 - what you see is what you get"? Because I'm not sure that would be fair to you.
And yeah, haven't we all made errors choosing men!
Posted by Susan47 on June 7, 2005, at 12:16:40
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by Tamar on June 7, 2005, at 5:07:17
Good question. No, no, not at all. I'm not being fair, am I? Hmh. Thinking that I would love, I really need, to have men friends. I just don't know how, I guess. I really want to, to know how to have men as friends. To not feel like I always have to back off.
Posted by Tamar on June 7, 2005, at 15:38:16
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Tamar, posted by Susan47 on June 7, 2005, at 12:16:40
> Good question. No, no, not at all. I'm not being fair, am I? Hmh. Thinking that I would love, I really need, to have men friends. I just don't know how, I guess. I really want to, to know how to have men as friends. To not feel like I always have to back off.
I think it’s a lot of fun having men as friends. Definitely worth trying if you haven’t done it before!
For me, it’s very much like having women as friends. I meet someone, I think he seems nice, we talk about stuff we both find interesting. Sometimes I find my men friends attractive, but it’s understood that it’s just a friendship and not a potential relationship.
But here’s the question… why do you feel like you always have to back off?
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 7, 2005, at 15:47:40
In reply to Wham. I got it. » caraher, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:48:18
> A confident man is really really sexy.
> Which makes me realize, when a man is dressed well, he feels more confident, LARRY HOOVER are you listening? Sweetheart, if you're confident and sexy in your well-cut jeans, okay. Hmm. But I'll bet if you're dressed like a million bucks, you're different. I'll bet you change, subtly, in ways you don't even see.Susan, dear, no one who didn't read our entire exchange over on Relationships would have the slightest idea why you mentioned me here, would they?
I did not mean to suggest that I don't like to dress up, nor that I do not clean up well. Rather, most days, I choose to wear comfortable clothes over ones that produce any particular "image". You will always get the authentic Lar, no matter what clothes I am in, or none.
Lar
Posted by gardenergirl on June 7, 2005, at 16:12:03
In reply to Re: Wham. I got it. » Susan47, posted by Larry Hoover on June 7, 2005, at 15:47:40
Posted by Damos on June 7, 2005, at 16:59:54
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:39:34
> "She is who she is and she's beautiful and perfect just as she is and what is truly attracting me comes from somewhere unexplainable deep inside anyway"
> and I absolutely melted, do you know how beautiful that sounds?It honestly hadn't occurred to me. It was/is just true for me. I hope some day soon someone helps you feel that it's true for you too.
Posted by Susan47 on June 7, 2005, at 23:13:36
In reply to Re: Wham. I got it. » Susan47, posted by Larry Hoover on June 7, 2005, at 15:47:40
Mm, you had to mention none, of course. Of course.
Posted by Susan47 on June 7, 2005, at 23:20:21
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by Tamar on June 7, 2005, at 15:38:16
Something about me seems to put men into defense mode. More when they're with their women, and women tend to be unfriendly towards me at first, when they get to know me, they're good.. that doesn't happen much, anymore, though. I've learned how to let myself come through enough, I've learned to be comfy with myself, and if a woman is stand-offish I can handle it well, now. I don't become angry or feel badly about myself. I used to. Now I just am learning, I guess, that not all men are potential enemies. Or something. Something that feels.. bad? Maybe men can be sweet, and kind, and humble .. there're so many insecure people out there. People are so mean to each other when they're insecure. They can be horrible. I guess, you know I think I've been around a lot of insecure men in my life. Too many. Never again. I can see them, now, a mile away, and I won't have anything to do with them. Even the nice ones.
Posted by Mr.Scott on June 8, 2005, at 2:32:34
In reply to This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 17:14:27
Sorry... but I didn't bring it up...and I just can't help myself from elaborating on the topic with my own spin...
Today I had sex twice, and am now going to masturbate.
First time was oral, and her first time swallowing 'ever' I might add. She didn't like it but wanted to try it. Who was I to try and stop her! She usually gives me head and I cum on her breasts.
Second time was vaginal and multi-positional, but it was hard to cum with the condom after already having earlier so she finished the job with her hand and some of that KY warming lotion. I love kissing her while she does that.
Now I'm going to masturbate (to her), as she has long since gone to bed. I smell her all over me as well as the vanilla flavored/scented lube. (I was just offered a new job today and am too excited to sleep!)
What can I say...I'm in love with her, I have a high sex drive especially since ditching the SSRI's! And a female started this thread. Surely I can't be blocked for that!
Scott
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 8, 2005, at 7:45:09
In reply to Re: Wham. I got it., posted by Susan47 on June 7, 2005, at 23:13:36
> Mm, you had to mention none, of course. Of course.
Of course.
I'm always reminded of one of the arguments forwarded for the naturist movement. Once thus relieved of attire, all are equalized.
Unfortunately for moi, t'ain't so. I sunburn in a New York minute, and the parts of me that ain't seen the sun fry even faster.
Lar
Posted by Susan47 on June 8, 2005, at 11:21:59
In reply to Re: Wham. I got it. » Susan47, posted by Larry Hoover on June 8, 2005, at 7:45:09
Hmm, You know, it's true those parts are more sun-sensitive. Start out with a New York thirty-seconder, then, and .. hmm.. let's see, .. through an open window, morning sun, around about 10:30 or so, that's a nice time.
I read that it's good to get the morning sun without sunscreen .. Vitamin D, I s'pose.
I burned a bit at the beach, yesterday .. it was worth it. I live in a lovely part of the world, y'know. I love being on the ocean, being able to go down anytime I like and listen to the waves hitting the rocky shore, watch them swirling around the larger rocks, breaking over reefs. It's the best place to write stuff. Even if it's garbage, it's still good garbage :)
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