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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Susan47 on June 5, 2005, at 22:44:28
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Tamar, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 22:30:46
I can't imagine friendly sex, just friendly like that, I don't know. I don't think I'd be satisfied. Question, Alexandra: can friendly sex also be passionate?
Posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 22:44:53
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 5, 2005, at 22:19:49
Now that's the question isn't it. I honestly can't remember when I didn't. I can't honestly remember ever knowing how to just let go and have fun and enjoy stuff like everyone else. I just don't know.
Posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 22:50:12
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Damos, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 22:32:07
Dear sweet Alex,
I wish I could see the me you see. Wish I could be the me you see.
(((((Alex)))))
Posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:14:44
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 5, 2005, at 22:44:28
> I can't imagine friendly sex, just friendly like that, I don't know. I don't think I'd be satisfied. Question, Alexandra: can friendly sex also be passionate?
Yes.
Absolutely.
I had one friend and our bodies were just terrific together.
And whats more you can imagine whatever you like.
But yeah, it can be great.
And it can be fun.
We played around a lot and tried out new stuff and joked around etc etc and had a lot of fun.
Fun and friendly and sexy too...
And no strings.
it worked out well.
But it is over now...
Hmm....
But for the best.
Still...
There was about 5 years of that.
Jeepers.
I just did the math.
Thats a while.
We'd have breaks while he had proper relationships with other women who would have objected.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:18:04
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » alexandra_k, posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 22:50:12
> I wish I could see the me you see.
Yeah. I wish you could too.
And not just me.
A lot of people here think you are wonderful Damos.
You are so sweet and caring and thoughtful and compassionate and fun.
I wish you could see that.
That it is a very lucky person indeed who gets to keep you.
And who gets to be loved by you.
That you are very special
And you deserve all the happiness
And you deserve to be really and truely cared about and loved and looked after the way that you are prepared to do all that for other people.>Wish I could be the me you see.
Nobody here sees all of me either.
I have some fairly crappy qualities and habits.
I like to think that I manage to keep the very worst hidden ;-)
But... I don't think that anything - no matter how big - could undermine the qualities that we do see.
You really are a terrific guy, Damos.
(((Damos)))
Posted by damos on June 6, 2005, at 1:43:53
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Damos, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:18:04
Thank you so much Alex. Maybe oneday, maybe someday. I hope so.
Don't forget you are and deserve all those things too.
(((((Alex)))))
Posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:51:03
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by Damos on June 5, 2005, at 17:01:41
Oh man, that's rough... I tend to forget what a piece of sh*t I think I am *during* sex, at least!
Afterward is another story... what I should have done, what I wished I hadn't.
Posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:53:57
In reply to This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 17:14:27
> I read recently that some men masturbate up to twice a day on a regular basis.. now, I think that's incredibly sexy. I wish I could do that, I wish I had that energy, that drive ... I want it too.
When I've done it that often it's generally because there's a huge void in my life that I'm distracting myself from. Not that I start with that thought. But afterwards it always hits me in the face. Which isn't terribly sexy
Posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 4, 2005, at 18:21:51
> So, when a man is making love to a woman, what is he thinking about? Do tell. I want to know. C'mon. Or is he thinking at all? What's he think about afterwards, when it's over? How do you know when, as a woman, you're being appreciated? How do you behave when you appreciate a woman?
I've only ever had sex with my wife so my thoughts may be unusual. But the first thing that surprises me about my thoughts during sex is that I *don't* find myself thinking about being with a different woman. That's not how I am all day long, but somehow having her there in the flesh pretty much wipes out the usual wandering thoughts.
The thoughts usually aren't all that deep during sex. For me they kind of circle about, changing from one to another with the following recurring themes: how good what's happening feels, how good she or some feature of her body looks or feels, wondering if she's enjoying it, should we do something different now, enjoying the sounds and expressions she makes, amazement at the realization that she enjoys it as much as i do. And I always find myself assessing how close we are to "finishing," since it generally works best if I follow a "ladies first" policy.
Afterward it varies a lot depending on circumstances. I don't think guys ever actually think about sleep; it just happens. If it's particularly good one of two "afterthoughts" come. One is not really a thought, just a kind of blissful exhaustion. That's a case where you should take a guy falling asleep as a compliment! ;) Otherwise I want to see her smile at me and think about how amazing it is that she could love me.
If your worrying about whether you're being "appreciated" don't overdo it. I concentrate so much on what I like about her that I don't even see the blemishes. Those fade away until afterward, unless she calls attention to them.
How can you tell if you're being appreciated? I think that's just too variable - it's a communication issue. So it comes down to knowing the individual man.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:42:24
In reply to Re: Damos, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:51:03
wouldn't there be another time to do other things? It can get better and better .. sounds like you're thinking of sex as kind of like a conversation, you know, where you say the wrong thing and there's no taking it back because the person doesn't have time to listen, or you want to say so much more but you can't ... do you want to do a heck of a lot more than you did? Are you holding back?
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:43:11
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:53:57
Hmm. I don't make that correlation. I think sex can become a huge issue if you're not getting any. That's the correlation I'd make.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:48:18
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
Ew, ew ew ew this is good. So you're not thinking during sex. And this is it, this is the huge thing I can't stop doing.
Okay.
So Confidence, as I've said over and over again, is important.. and I'm thinking maybe it's important because it allows you to be a better lover .. because you don't worry about how you look, how the other person is seeing you, because you're okay about all that and you can really lose yourself...
A confident man is really really sexy.
Which makes me realize, when a man is dressed well, he feels more confident, LARRY HOOVER are you listening? Sweetheart, if you're confident and sexy in your well-cut jeans, okay. Hmm. But I'll bet if you're dressed like a million bucks, you're different. I'll bet you change, subtly, in ways you don't even see.
But we do.
Yes.
Women notice, darlin'.
Caraher, I have to read the rest of your post, it's thought-provoking stuff you're giving me, ew I love you thank you.
Okay, enough Susan, down, girl.
Sometimes I have to bring myself down, my enthusiasm, you know, it's too much, a bit like an enthusiastic, wriggling little puppy.. honestly, I'm almost ssshhhh .. 48.. soon ... ew.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:49:05
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
I love that your wife, in the flesh, wipes out your wandering thoughts.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 14:52:29
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
Yes, I've never taken the time to really know a man. My problem, always too afraid of them, intimidated by their power .. trying to get a feel for myself, and I hope I have one, now. I also hope to someday have a real man in my bed again, or anywhere, outdoors, on the beach, in the rain, in the forest ... I don't care, really. I need to feel skin on skin, stroking and caressing and licking and .. I guess I drew the picture.
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 16:45:50
In reply to Re: Damos, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 13:51:03
> Afterward is another story... what I should have done, what I wished I hadn't.
Oh yeah, know that story well too. Hope we can both find a place where we don't ever need to feel like this.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:23:53
In reply to caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 16:45:50
> > Afterward is another story... what I should have done, what I wished I hadn't.
>
> Oh yeah, know that story well too. Hope we can both find a place where we don't ever need to feel like this.I hope so too. Because I think sex shouldn't be about following a formula; or about doing things on a list, or not doing particular things. Anything you didn't do today, you can do tomorrow. Anything that didn't feel quite right today can be changed tomorrow, just like any other way of expressing love or appreciation for someone else.
Sex is almost never perfect; it's a work in progress. Every time we do it, it acquires new nuances.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:14:44
> > I can't imagine friendly sex, just friendly like that, I don't know. I don't think I'd be satisfied. Question, Alexandra: can friendly sex also be passionate?
>
> Yes.
> Absolutely.I totally agree. In fact, sometimes friendly sex has been more fulfilling for me than relationship sex.
For me, there's a different dynamic with friendly sex. But it's still an expression of love; it's just a different kind of love.
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by caraher on June 6, 2005, at 14:20:35
Caraher,
There is so much you so here that's true for me too. I've never thought of any woman other than the one I was with. And when I did have thoughts about it during the day, it was almost always about the next time I would be with that person - not a whole bunch of others.
The sleep thing is interesting because they did actually research it and the act of ejaculating does cause the release of chemicals that make you want to sleep. Pre sleep though my thoughs were pretty much the same as those you expressed and wondering how someone so beautiful could want to be with me like that.
And you're absolutely right about the invisibility of imperfections except that it's true always before, during and after. She is who she is and she's beautiful and perfect just as she is and what is truly attracting me comes from somewhere unexplainable deep inside anyway.
The appreciatiion thing is a hard one. I guess I've never been good at it (or at least don't think I am) but that's about me not feeling like I deserve to be there, not about not appreciating her. More often than not, even when I've felt bad about myself, lookin ginto the eyes of this beautiful person beside me and the though of her having given herself to me in such a way makes me want to cry.
Posted by alexandra_k on June 6, 2005, at 17:38:07
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » alexandra_k, posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
>In fact, sometimes friendly sex has been more fulfilling for me than relationship sex.
Hmm. I've never had relationship sex.
> For me, there's a different dynamic with friendly sex. But it's still an expression of love; it's just a different kind of love.
Yeah. Thats spot on. It still is an expression of love - just a different kind of love :-)
It's not like I sleep with ALL my male friends either - there has to be an attraction from both sides but no desire for anything more (otherwise it would end badly)
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:39:10
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Susan47, posted by alexandra_k on June 5, 2005, at 23:14:44
Now you see, I can understand the 'friendly sex' thing and can see how beautiful and wonderful it could be, and I'm glad you could experience that. I get it so totally. Strange.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:36:55
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » alexandra_k, posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 17:28:26
It sounds interesting. Very. I'm having a hard time with the concept. I've never been friends with any men. Or boys either, for that matter. But, it would be nice. Lovely, maybe. I never knew how to be friends with men, but lately I've been really feeling it, the kinship, the human being behind the maleness. Lovely, lovely maleness, the more male, the more lovely. No, no no no that's not even true. Hmm. Because hairy bullish types are out. O-u-t. Unless they have oustanding character. I guess it's like, some men will only be with a blonde, only a blonde really does it for them. As a woman I don't feel badly for having my preferences. Not at all. Hmm. Never knew I had 'em, before now. But I do. I absolutely do.
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:39:34
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
I just realized something, Damos, reading your post. You said this,
"She is who she is and she's beautiful and perfect just as she is and what is truly attracting me comes from somewhere unexplainable deep inside anyway"
and I absolutely melted, do you know how beautiful that sounds?
Posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:46:51
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » caraher, posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 17:34:37
I just also realized something important about me, it's about being appreciated, knowing I'm appreciated.
I used to get flowers quite a bit, from men, when I was single. And when you're young, and you're single, that's expected. But when I received them, there was an unspoken message hiding in them .. it was .. "this is okay because we're sleeping together, now", or, "I'm going to push for you to have sex with me, I'm showing you I deserve it" or "Tom did this for his girlfriend, and I'm at least as classy as he is, so here" or something like that. Always a motive, always a reason.. but never, never once was I really that reason, you know? But a friend gave me flowers last week, and I just loved that she found me special enough to do that for me. It made my day, really, literally. I'm learning.. learning to appreciate the intensity of my emotional life, how important it is to me, and other people, too. It's why the down times are so incredibly bad.
Posted by Tamar on June 6, 2005, at 19:11:59
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:36:55
> It sounds interesting. Very. I'm having a hard time with the concept. I've never been friends with any men. Or boys either, for that matter. But, it would be nice.
I wondered about that when you first posted about friendly sex. But you seem to be friends with some men here at babble. Is it so different in real life? And of course you can still flirt with friends… it’s just that they’re basically friends rather than basically potential partners.
> Lovely, lovely maleness, the more male, the more lovely. No, no no no that's not even true. Hmm. Because hairy bullish types are out. O-u-t.
What’s wrong with hairy? I love hairy. I can be attracted to men with very little body hair, but generally I love hair everywhere. I remember (years ago) a new partner took off his shirt and I saw his chest for the first time, and I hadn’t expected it but he was just extremely hairy. What a lovely surprise that was! …. OK, I’m back now…
> Unless they have oustanding character. I guess it's like, some men will only be with a blonde, only a blonde really does it for them. As a woman I don't feel badly for having my preferences. Not at all. Hmm. Never knew I had 'em, before now. But I do. I absolutely do.
Nothing wrong with preferences. The thing to avoid (IMHO) is prejudices. By all means be attracted to dark hair or dark eyes or an athletic physique or a smooth chest or a well-cut suit. But of course we can’t assume that men who fit a certain description are going to be good men. The great thing about men is that they’re so wonderfully various. If we never look at men who diverge from our ‘ideal’ we might well miss out on some really fantastic guys. I reckon we would do well to admire all kinds of men…
Posted by Damos on June 6, 2005, at 21:39:06
In reply to Re: This is about Sex and Men » Damos, posted by Susan47 on June 6, 2005, at 18:46:51
I'm really sorry that's the case Suze. Now see, I love to give them for no reason other than the appreciation I can't always express in words. Never, ever in expectation or to keep up with someone else. Just for the joy I experience through the recipient. It's also why I've taken to sending Thank You cards, and I'm now experiencing a sense of joy in the act of appreciating the other person totally independant of their response. The desire to send flowers to some of my babble friends is pretty simply because I can't always express how very much they mean to me and how much I appreciate their kindness and support. Or just to say, I feel your pain and wanted to do something that was just about who you are to me.
And yet I know my father has never ever bought flowers in his life and it simply wouldn't occur to him.
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