![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dave@MT on February 24, 2001, at 15:12:02
I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
Appreciate any info.
Dave@MT
Posted by Sunnely on February 24, 2001, at 21:58:18
In reply to Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Dave@MT on February 24, 2001, at 15:12:02
Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
================================================
> I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
>
> Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
>
> Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
>
> Appreciate any info.
>
> Dave@MT
Posted by Dave@MT on February 24, 2001, at 22:28:13
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ? » Dave@MT, posted by Sunnely on February 24, 2001, at 21:58:18
Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
What is "serotonin syndrome"?
Thanks for your quick response!
Dave
> Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
>
> A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
>
> ================================================
>
> > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> >
> > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> >
> > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> >
> > Appreciate any info.
> >
> > Dave@MT
Posted by Sunnely on February 25, 2001, at 22:47:51
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Dave@MT on February 24, 2001, at 22:28:13
"Serotonin syndrome" is a serious condition that can result in death. It is usually caused by increased serotonin stimulation. The most common pharmacological interaction that results in serotonin syndrome is the concurrent use of a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI) with either tryptophan, tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs) or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs).
Symptoms of serotonin syndrome may include mood or behavioral changes (confusion, agitation, mania), fever, increased sweating, restlessness, tremor, muscle rigidity, shivering (teeth chattering) or shaking, racing heartbeat, rapid breathing, overactive reflexes, muscle twitchings, diarrhea.
With regards to problem # 2 (priapism - persistent and painful penile erection from trazodone), good that it does not seem to affect you. However, there have been men prescribed trazodone who were not aware of this potential side effect, and learned about it the "hard" way, literarily. :-)
=================================================
> Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
>
> What is "serotonin syndrome"?
>
> Thanks for your quick response!
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
> >
> > A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
> >
> > ================================================
> >
> > > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> > >
> > > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> > >
> > > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> > >
> > > Appreciate any info.
> > >
> > > Dave@MT
Posted by Dave@MT on February 26, 2001, at 20:51:25
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ? » Dave@MT, posted by Sunnely on February 25, 2001, at 22:47:51
Well Sun
I appreciate the info. I don't suppose you have any insight on "electric head" symptoms associated with SRRI withdrawal - Remeron then Luvox in my particular case?
I must say, in addition to being no slouch around the finer points of psymeds, you seem to be something of an expert on certain other "hard" subjects. Personal experience, or simply academic?
Dave
> "Serotonin syndrome" is a serious condition that can result in death. It is usually caused by increased serotonin stimulation. The most common pharmacological interaction that results in serotonin syndrome is the concurrent use of a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI) with either tryptophan, tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs) or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs).
>
> Symptoms of serotonin syndrome may include mood or behavioral changes (confusion, agitation, mania), fever, increased sweating, restlessness, tremor, muscle rigidity, shivering (teeth chattering) or shaking, racing heartbeat, rapid breathing, overactive reflexes, muscle twitchings, diarrhea.
>
> With regards to problem # 2 (priapism - persistent and painful penile erection from trazodone), good that it does not seem to affect you. However, there have been men prescribed trazodone who were not aware of this potential side effect, and learned about it the "hard" way, literarily. :-)
>
> =================================================
>
> > Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
> >
> > What is "serotonin syndrome"?
> >
> > Thanks for your quick response!
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
> > >
> > > A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
> > >
> > > ================================================
> > >
> > > > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> > > >
> > > > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> > > >
> > > > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> > > >
> > > > Appreciate any info.
> > > >
> > > > Dave@MT
Posted by Sunnely on February 26, 2001, at 21:43:37
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Dave@MT on February 26, 2001, at 20:51:25
Dave,
I'm not sure what you meant by "electric head" pertaining to SSRI withdrawal. However, one of the SRI-withdrawal symptoms commonly reported is "electric-shock" like sensations of certain body parts. As Cam indicated in his response to another post, the shorter half-lives SRIs (serotonin reuptake inhibitors) are commonly associated with withdrawal symptoms.
SRI-withdrawal symptoms usually begin between 2 and 5 days after the last dose of the medication, although in some cases, can begin before the medicine is totally discontinued. With certain antidepressants (e.g., Effexor), withdrawal symptoms can occur even after missing a single dose.
Withdrawal symptoms can last up to several weeks and are typically mitigated by reintroducing the withdrawn antidepressant.
Although these antidepressants are not "habit forming," patients are advised not to discontinue an antidepressant abruptly - one of the common causes of withdrawal symptoms.
I posted the following a few months back but I think it's worth revisiting. Withdrawal symptoms from antidepressants can be summed up in the following mnemonic, FINISH (Cam uses the mnemonic FLUSH):
F = Flu-like symptoms (lethargy, fatigue, headache, achiness, sweating)
I = Insomnia (with vivid dreams or nightmares)
N = Nausea (sometines vomiting)
I = Imbalance (dizziness, vertigo, lightheadedness)
S = Sensory disturbances ("burning," "tingling," or "electric-shock" like sensations)
H = Hyperarousal (anxiety, irritability, agitation, aggression, mania)
Other symptoms reported include worsening of depressiion, suicidal thoughts and hallucinations.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Well Sun
>
> I appreciate the info. I don't suppose you have any insight on "electric head" symptoms associated with SRRI withdrawal - Remeron then Luvox in my particular case?
>
> I must say, in addition to being no slouch around the finer points of psymeds, you seem to be something of an expert on certain other "hard" subjects. Personal experience, or simply academic?
>
> Dave
>
> > "Serotonin syndrome" is a serious condition that can result in death. It is usually caused by increased serotonin stimulation. The most common pharmacological interaction that results in serotonin syndrome is the concurrent use of a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI) with either tryptophan, tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs) or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs).
> >
> > Symptoms of serotonin syndrome may include mood or behavioral changes (confusion, agitation, mania), fever, increased sweating, restlessness, tremor, muscle rigidity, shivering (teeth chattering) or shaking, racing heartbeat, rapid breathing, overactive reflexes, muscle twitchings, diarrhea.
> >
> > With regards to problem # 2 (priapism - persistent and painful penile erection from trazodone), good that it does not seem to affect you. However, there have been men prescribed trazodone who were not aware of this potential side effect, and learned about it the "hard" way, literarily. :-)
> >
> > =================================================
> >
> > > Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
> > >
> > > What is "serotonin syndrome"?
> > >
> > > Thanks for your quick response!
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
> > > >
> > > > A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
> > > >
> > > > ================================================
> > > >
> > > > > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> > > > >
> > > > > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> > > > >
> > > > > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> > > > >
> > > > > Appreciate any info.
> > > > >
> > > > > Dave@MT
Posted by Cam W. on February 27, 2001, at 6:47:27
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Sunnely on February 26, 2001, at 21:43:37
Sunnely - I have heard of this "electric shock" in the head. It seems to be a long-term symptom of seroternic drug withdrawl and can last months. It has been described as a "kind of vibration/crackling or short-lived pop/buzz" in the head. This is one side effect that has made me wonder on several occasions. It does seem to start upon abrupt withdrawl of the short acting serotonergic agents and can even continue when a weaning regimen is reinstated. I have never personally heard of someone mention this, but have read of it in the literature. I do not know what kind of weaning process was eventually initiated,
either. It seems to be a real phenomenon, though, and could have to do with either a problem of reinstating appropriate levels of the serotonin reuptake transporter, the 5-HTB1 receptor, or the norepinephrine reuptake transporter; all of which have recently been shown to be linked to one another. I have a feeling (and it is just a feeling) that the inability of certain people's biochemistry to "renormalize' or upregulate the norepinephrine transporter upon withdrawl of the serotonergic agent may be at the heart of these "electric shocks".Do you have any comments or thoughts on this? - Cam
Posted by JahL on February 27, 2001, at 14:14:41
In reply to Re: Electric Shock » Sunnely, posted by Cam W. on February 27, 2001, at 6:47:27
> Sunnely - I have heard of this "electric shock" in the head. It seems to be a long-term symptom of seroternic drug withdrawl and can last months. It has been described as a "kind of vibration/crackling or short-lived pop/buzz" in the head. This is one side effect that has made me wonder on several occasions. It does seem to start upon abrupt withdrawl of the short acting serotonergic agents and can even continue when a weaning regimen is reinstated. I have never personally heard of someone mention this, but have read of it in the literature.
Hi Cam.
I most definitely have experienced this. I've tried all the serotinergic drugs and there were 2 main offenders; Paxil & nefazadone, both of which I stopped abruptly. I also stopped Prozac quite suddenly but remained free from the effects you describe. These effects have never occurred on any other drug. This all seems to concur with what you've read (re:half-lives etc). In both cases the withdrawal effects resolved themselves quite suddenly after about a week.
Posters on this site have mentioned 'brain flashes' in the past-I wonder if this is the same thing?
Jah.
Posted by Pandora on February 27, 2001, at 14:33:03
In reply to Re: Electric Shock, posted by JahL on February 27, 2001, at 14:14:41
I've been on Effexor for about 2 1/2 years and for the last 6 months or so, I have experienced a "crackling" sensation in my head. It seems to only occur when I'm lying down (trying to go to sleep) and I only feel it at the back of my neck/base of my skull. It isn't painful, but is somehow unsettling, kind of like hearing fingernails on a chalkboard. Aside from an occasional missed dose early on, I have only ever increased my dosage of Effexor. Has anyone else had this type of experience not associated with withdrawal?
Posted by NikkiT2 on February 27, 2001, at 15:21:34
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Sunnely on February 26, 2001, at 21:43:37
Wow - I've never seen the withdrawal from Effexor writen so well and succintly.
Excellent post!
Nikki
> Dave,
>
> I'm not sure what you meant by "electric head" pertaining to SSRI withdrawal. However, one of the SRI-withdrawal symptoms commonly reported is "electric-shock" like sensations of certain body parts. As Cam indicated in his response to another post, the shorter half-lives SRIs (serotonin reuptake inhibitors) are commonly associated with withdrawal symptoms.
>
> SRI-withdrawal symptoms usually begin between 2 and 5 days after the last dose of the medication, although in some cases, can begin before the medicine is totally discontinued. With certain antidepressants (e.g., Effexor), withdrawal symptoms can occur even after missing a single dose.
>
> Withdrawal symptoms can last up to several weeks and are typically mitigated by reintroducing the withdrawn antidepressant.
>
> Although these antidepressants are not "habit forming," patients are advised not to discontinue an antidepressant abruptly - one of the common causes of withdrawal symptoms.
>
> I posted the following a few months back but I think it's worth revisiting. Withdrawal symptoms from antidepressants can be summed up in the following mnemonic, FINISH (Cam uses the mnemonic FLUSH):
>
> F = Flu-like symptoms (lethargy, fatigue, headache, achiness, sweating)
>
> I = Insomnia (with vivid dreams or nightmares)
>
> N = Nausea (sometines vomiting)
>
> I = Imbalance (dizziness, vertigo, lightheadedness)
>
> S = Sensory disturbances ("burning," "tingling," or "electric-shock" like sensations)
>
> H = Hyperarousal (anxiety, irritability, agitation, aggression, mania)
>
> Other symptoms reported include worsening of depressiion, suicidal thoughts and hallucinations.
>
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> > Well Sun
> >
> > I appreciate the info. I don't suppose you have any insight on "electric head" symptoms associated with SRRI withdrawal - Remeron then Luvox in my particular case?
> >
> > I must say, in addition to being no slouch around the finer points of psymeds, you seem to be something of an expert on certain other "hard" subjects. Personal experience, or simply academic?
> >
> > Dave
> >
> > > "Serotonin syndrome" is a serious condition that can result in death. It is usually caused by increased serotonin stimulation. The most common pharmacological interaction that results in serotonin syndrome is the concurrent use of a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI) with either tryptophan, tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs) or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs).
> > >
> > > Symptoms of serotonin syndrome may include mood or behavioral changes (confusion, agitation, mania), fever, increased sweating, restlessness, tremor, muscle rigidity, shivering (teeth chattering) or shaking, racing heartbeat, rapid breathing, overactive reflexes, muscle twitchings, diarrhea.
> > >
> > > With regards to problem # 2 (priapism - persistent and painful penile erection from trazodone), good that it does not seem to affect you. However, there have been men prescribed trazodone who were not aware of this potential side effect, and learned about it the "hard" way, literarily. :-)
> > >
> > > =================================================
> > >
> > > > Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
> > > >
> > > > What is "serotonin syndrome"?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for your quick response!
> > > >
> > > > Dave
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
> > > > >
> > > > > A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
> > > > >
> > > > > ================================================
> > > > >
> > > > > > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Appreciate any info.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dave@MT
Posted by NikkiT2 on February 27, 2001, at 15:23:53
In reply to Re: Electric Shock, posted by Pandora on February 27, 2001, at 14:33:03
Do you take all your dose in the morning?? It could be that your dose is wearing out by the time you go to bed and you sytart suffering withdrawal... Maybe by splitting the dose it would help..
Nikki
> I've been on Effexor for about 2 1/2 years and for the last 6 months or so, I have experienced a "crackling" sensation in my head. It seems to only occur when I'm lying down (trying to go to sleep) and I only feel it at the back of my neck/base of my skull. It isn't painful, but is somehow unsettling, kind of like hearing fingernails on a chalkboard. Aside from an occasional missed dose early on, I have only ever increased my dosage of Effexor. Has anyone else had this type of experience not associated with withdrawal?
Posted by Pandora on February 27, 2001, at 16:47:48
In reply to Re: Electric Shock » Pandora, posted by NikkiT2 on February 27, 2001, at 15:23:53
Interesting idea... it doesn't happen all the time, and it's not particularly bothersome, but I'll talk to my doc about splitting the dose and see if this helps. Thanks for the idea.
> Do you take all your dose in the morning?? It could be that your dose is wearing out by the time you go to bed and you sytart suffering withdrawal... Maybe by splitting the dose it would help..
>
> Nikki
>
> > I've been on Effexor for about 2 1/2 years and for the last 6 months or so, I have experienced a "crackling" sensation in my head. It seems to only occur when I'm lying down (trying to go to sleep) and I only feel it at the back of my neck/base of my skull. It isn't painful, but is somehow unsettling, kind of like hearing fingernails on a chalkboard. Aside from an occasional missed dose early on, I have only ever increased my dosage of Effexor. Has anyone else had this type of experience not associated with withdrawal?
Posted by SLS on February 27, 2001, at 19:15:48
In reply to Re: Electric Shock » Sunnely, posted by Cam W. on February 27, 2001, at 6:47:27
Hi.
> I have heard of this "electric shock" in the head.
> It seems to be a long-term symptom of seroternic drug withdrawl and can last months. It has been described as a "kind of vibration/crackling or short-lived pop/buzz" in the head.
You can add me to the list. Definitely with Effexor, but also with other drugs when I discontinued them too abruptly, including Parnate. Someone along this thread mentioned having the same thing happen with Serzone.
Has trazodone ever been considered to help mitigate SRI withdrawal? Might mCPP make it worse?
- Scott
Posted by Sunnely on February 27, 2001, at 23:17:38
In reply to Re: Electric Shock » Sunnely, posted by Cam W. on February 27, 2001, at 6:47:27
Sorry, other than the hypothesized hyposerotonergic state causing SRI-withdrawal symptoms, not sure if there are other mechanisms involved. However, I think you may be right about the problem with reupregulating the norepinephrine (NE) having a role in withdrawal symptoms.
When we think of SRI-withdrawal, we seem to think immediately of the role of serotonin (5HT), and tend to forget that 5HT, NE, DA, acetylcholine (muscarinic), GABA, etc. are extensively colocalized in the brain that one neurotransmitter tends to interfere/influence another neurotransmitters's function. For example, paroxetine (Paxil), although an SSRI has also anticholinergic effect (in higher doses). Abrupt discontinuation may bring about symptoms of hyposerotonergic state and "cholinergic rebound." With regard to Effexor, abrupt discontinuation may lead to symptoms of hyposerotonergic and NE-deficiency states.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Sunnely - I have heard of this "electric shock" in the head. It seems to be a long-term symptom of seroternic drug withdrawl and can last months. It has been described as a "kind of vibration/crackling or short-lived pop/buzz" in the head. This is one side effect that has made me wonder on several occasions. It does seem to start upon abrupt withdrawl of the short acting serotonergic agents and can even continue when a weaning regimen is reinstated. I have never personally heard of someone mention this, but have read of it in the literature. I do not know what kind of weaning process was eventually initiated,
> either. It seems to be a real phenomenon, though, and could have to do with either a problem of reinstating appropriate levels of the serotonin reuptake transporter, the 5-HTB1 receptor, or the norepinephrine reuptake transporter; all of which have recently been shown to be linked to one another. I have a feeling (and it is just a feeling) that the inability of certain people's biochemistry to "renormalize' or upregulate the norepinephrine transporter upon withdrawl of the serotonergic agent may be at the heart of these "electric shocks".
>
> Do you have any comments or thoughts on this? - Cam
Posted by Dave@MT on February 28, 2001, at 20:49:40
In reply to Re: Anyone using Trazedon to help sleep w/SRRI's ?, posted by Sunnely on February 26, 2001, at 21:43:37
Sun
Thanks very much for the excellent info. This is exactly the kind of objective input I need to understand what is going on. You have encouraged me a lot.
Thanx Again!
Dave@MT
> Dave,
>
> I'm not sure what you meant by "electric head" pertaining to SSRI withdrawal. However, one of the SRI-withdrawal symptoms commonly reported is "electric-shock" like sensations of certain body parts. As Cam indicated in his response to another post, the shorter half-lives SRIs (serotonin reuptake inhibitors) are commonly associated with withdrawal symptoms.
>
> SRI-withdrawal symptoms usually begin between 2 and 5 days after the last dose of the medication, although in some cases, can begin before the medicine is totally discontinued. With certain antidepressants (e.g., Effexor), withdrawal symptoms can occur even after missing a single dose.
>
> Withdrawal symptoms can last up to several weeks and are typically mitigated by reintroducing the withdrawn antidepressant.
>
> Although these antidepressants are not "habit forming," patients are advised not to discontinue an antidepressant abruptly - one of the common causes of withdrawal symptoms.
>
> I posted the following a few months back but I think it's worth revisiting. Withdrawal symptoms from antidepressants can be summed up in the following mnemonic, FINISH (Cam uses the mnemonic FLUSH):
>
> F = Flu-like symptoms (lethargy, fatigue, headache, achiness, sweating)
>
> I = Insomnia (with vivid dreams or nightmares)
>
> N = Nausea (sometines vomiting)
>
> I = Imbalance (dizziness, vertigo, lightheadedness)
>
> S = Sensory disturbances ("burning," "tingling," or "electric-shock" like sensations)
>
> H = Hyperarousal (anxiety, irritability, agitation, aggression, mania)
>
> Other symptoms reported include worsening of depressiion, suicidal thoughts and hallucinations.
>
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> > Well Sun
> >
> > I appreciate the info. I don't suppose you have any insight on "electric head" symptoms associated with SRRI withdrawal - Remeron then Luvox in my particular case?
> >
> > I must say, in addition to being no slouch around the finer points of psymeds, you seem to be something of an expert on certain other "hard" subjects. Personal experience, or simply academic?
> >
> > Dave
> >
> > > "Serotonin syndrome" is a serious condition that can result in death. It is usually caused by increased serotonin stimulation. The most common pharmacological interaction that results in serotonin syndrome is the concurrent use of a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI) with either tryptophan, tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs) or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs).
> > >
> > > Symptoms of serotonin syndrome may include mood or behavioral changes (confusion, agitation, mania), fever, increased sweating, restlessness, tremor, muscle rigidity, shivering (teeth chattering) or shaking, racing heartbeat, rapid breathing, overactive reflexes, muscle twitchings, diarrhea.
> > >
> > > With regards to problem # 2 (priapism - persistent and painful penile erection from trazodone), good that it does not seem to affect you. However, there have been men prescribed trazodone who were not aware of this potential side effect, and learned about it the "hard" way, literarily. :-)
> > >
> > > =================================================
> > >
> > > > Concern #2 is not a problem... :-)
> > > >
> > > > What is "serotonin syndrome"?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for your quick response!
> > > >
> > > > Dave
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Trazodone at low doses (25-50 mg at bedtime as sleeper) and an SSRI is a fairly common combination.
> > > > >
> > > > > A couple of precautions when combining these 2 drugs: 1) serotonin syndrome, and 2) priapism. Case reports of serotonin syndrome have been reported with this trazodone-SRI combination. Usually reversible once the offending drugs are discontinued. Rarely, can be serious and deadly. Priapism is the painful and persistent penile erection not associated with emotional arousal. Most commonly reported with the use of trazodone. If not treated immediately, it could lead to impotence.
> > > > >
> > > > > ================================================
> > > > >
> > > > > > I am about off Luvox, no dose for about 7-8 days.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Had been taking 25-50 mg Trazedon at bedtime to help sleep.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Has anyone else used low doses of Trazedon to help sleep with SRRI's?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Appreciate any info.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dave@MT
Posted by Dave@MT on February 28, 2001, at 21:18:28
In reply to Re: Electric Shock » Sunnely, posted by Cam W. on February 27, 2001, at 6:47:27
> > Sunnely & Cam
I appreciate both your helpful responses, thanks.
For the record what I referred to as "electric head" - courtesy of Abbi - is surely what you two are talking about.
It feels to me as if an electric charge builds up in your head, then discharges through your entire nervous system. The intensity of the "discharges" can vary. At worst, it can momentarily disorient you - just like receiving a sharp smack to the head. At times, especially when you are standing up, you can feel it in the soles of your feet, just as if an electric current were trying to go to ground through them.
I - and a few others I have netted with - agree that it seems to be brought on by moving your head or even just your eyes. Or, it can occur spontaneously, even when you are sitting perfectly still.
When I first began ramping off Luvox, and I went past the point where I "should" have taken a dose, the sensations would build to the point the sensations would build in rapidity and intensity until I had to take a low dose just to get some relief.I am very happy to say that I've been completely off now for about 8 days and I hardly notice it anymore. See the Luvox withdrawal thread if you are interested in the details - I ramped down fairly slowly, and that is surely the key here.
Thanks again
Dave@MT> Sunnely - I have heard of this "electric shock" in the head. It seems to be a long-term symptom of seroternic drug withdrawl and can last months. It has been described as a "kind of vibration/crackling or short-lived pop/buzz" in the head. This is one side effect that has made me wonder on several occasions. It does seem to start upon abrupt withdrawl of the short acting serotonergic agents and can even continue when a weaning regimen is reinstated. I have never personally heard of someone mention this, but have read of it in the literature. I do not know what kind of weaning process was eventually initiated,
> either. It seems to be a real phenomenon, though, and could have to do with either a problem of reinstating appropriate levels of the serotonin reuptake transporter, the 5-HTB1 receptor, or the norepinephrine reuptake transporter; all of which have recently been shown to be linked to one another. I have a feeling (and it is just a feeling) that the inability of certain people's biochemistry to "renormalize' or upregulate the norepinephrine transporter upon withdrawl of the serotonergic agent may be at the heart of these "electric shocks".
>
> Do you have any comments or thoughts on this? - Cam
Posted by Cam W. on February 28, 2001, at 23:02:54
In reply to Re: Electric Shock, posted by Dave@MT on February 28, 2001, at 21:18:28
Dave - Thanks for the description of the "electric shocks". Reports like these do help to understand what people are trying to describe in clinical practice. I'll be sure to ask about these symptoms when I encounter people with serotonin withdrawl syndrome.
Again, much obliged - Cam
> > > Sunnely & Cam
>
> I appreciate both your helpful responses, thanks.
>
> For the record what I referred to as "electric head" - courtesy of Abbi - is surely what you two are talking about.
>
> It feels to me as if an electric charge builds up in your head, then discharges through your entire nervous system. The intensity of the "discharges" can vary. At worst, it can momentarily disorient you - just like receiving a sharp smack to the head. At times, especially when you are standing up, you can feel it in the soles of your feet, just as if an electric current were trying to go to ground through them.
>
> I - and a few others I have netted with - agree that it seems to be brought on by moving your head or even just your eyes. Or, it can occur spontaneously, even when you are sitting perfectly still.
>
> When I first began ramping off Luvox, and I went past the point where I "should" have taken a dose, the sensations would build to the point the sensations would build in rapidity and intensity until I had to take a low dose just to get some relief.I am very happy to say that I've been completely off now for about 8 days and I hardly notice it anymore. See the Luvox withdrawal thread if you are interested in the details - I ramped down fairly slowly, and that is surely the key here.
>
> Thanks again
> Dave@MT
This is the end of the thread.
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