Posted by yxibow on March 9, 2009, at 5:33:51
In reply to Re: ace inhibitors/Angiotensin II receptor antagonists, posted by desolationrower on March 9, 2009, at 2:27:21
> > > lots of discussion about these on mindandmsucle at one point
> > >
> > > has anyone used one?
> > >
> > > any effect on mood?
> > >
> > > any effect on body composition?
> > >
> > > if you want to play along at home, pomegranate and tea are ACE inhibitors
> > >
> > > -d/r
> >
> >
> > I believe that they should only be used on heart patients with a definite indication. They have a lot of potential side effects.
> >
> > My mother has permanent angioedema from an ACE inhibitor that was relatively new at the time. She takes a load of antihistamines to prevent a possible anaphylaxis.
> >
> > It was also known unfortunately at the time or shortly after, I believe, that this was an emergent effect in patients.
> >
> > Just due caution. They're much more serious agents than beta blockers and calcium channel blockers.
> >
> > -- Jay
>
> well the side effects aren't as bad as neuroleptics, which don't have any health benefits to accompany their risks.
>
> -d/r
That's a completely broad generalization of antipsychotics. No health benefits ???
Of course there are health benefits, if mental health is on par with physical health which it should be.
Bringing people with severe bipolar or schizophrenic spectrum disorders out of a darkness, is just one I can name.
Preventing suicide in patients who have psychosis spectrum disorders is just one of many.
Yes, atypicals have side effects too, I don't need to be educated what Seroquel did to me, not to mention an aborted trial of Zyprexa, but these were rare effects.
And yes, I still take Seroquel for a very complicated off label use, because it allows me to have 'better functionality', a clinical term, but nonetheless important.They're far from perfect and I would be the first to say that taken as directed at a minimum effective dose, benzodiazepines are probably among the safest psychiatric agents, and yes, a variety of APs have notable risks. That's why they should be used judiciously and at their MED (minimum effective dose)
Side effects of ACE inhibitors can be just as permanent, and/or dangerous, if not more. You're talking about agents that directly act upon heart functions and should really only be cautiously used with people with fairly high blood pressure or congestive heart failure. Unproductive coughs, the list goes on to more serious effects.
Its risky waters, is what I'm saying to do off-label things with what are probably among our most powerful heart drugs before such agents heparin and amiodarone.Other antiarrhythmics pose less danger and are used frequently, such as beta blockers such aspropranolol and off lable uses of heart medications such as clonidine and guanfacine, which also shouldn't be combined together with beta blockers.
And they still have liability, pulse and blood pressure changes, that mean that continuous use and discontinuing them means gradual de-use.
-- Jay
poster:yxibow
thread:884211
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20090304/msgs/884557.html