Posted by SLS on February 28, 2001, at 19:26:25
In reply to Re: Which is least bad: Zyprexa or Risperdal , posted by steve on February 28, 2001, at 17:38:53
Steve,
> You insinuated that topics once brought up don't belong on the board.
I guess I did. I was wrong. I apologize. I just get lazy sometimes.
> You don't refer to the points I made.
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Here is your original post:
> Are y'all aware of the brain shrinkage associated with both drugs:
Check this link out and go to Madsen:> or go to this link:
> http://www.neurolinguistic.com/proxima/articoli/art-55.htm
> I really, really think patients should be made aware of the brain damage they face before they begin taking neuroleptics.
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> And you call me mindless.No. I called my reply mindless.
I believe I sufficiently addressed your contention that Risperdal and Zyprexa both cause brain shrinkage and brain damage. I used your own citation to help me do so.
** Why don't YOU address my follow-up points **
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Three problems:#1 These studies are of patients suffering from schizophrenia, a disorder for which the natural course involves a loss of brain tissue.
#2 You are using a "bibliography" that seems biased in its selection of annotations to support the claim stated in its title. The author found what he was looking for. The author shows his transparant agenda with his somewhat passionate use of the term "brain damage". By the way, the ONLY appearance of the word "damage" is that of the author's in his paraphrasing with the following exceptions:
- Previous brain INJURY and how such might impact upon subsequent neuroleptic treatment.
- PROPOSED oxidative free-radical damage and the accumulation of glutamatergic exitotoxic substances in an attempt to explain tardive dyskinisia. NO DATA was offered. Both of these things can occur with a multitude of drugs.
#3 The results of a thorough literature search will demonstrate equivocal and contradictory data and conclusions regarding this issue.
FROM THE BIBLIOGRAPHY YOU CITED !I capitalized the words or phrases I thought were particular salient with regard to your supposition.
This review cites AN INCREASE AND NOT A SHRINKAGE in the size of VARIOUS STRUCTURES of the brain due to exposure to neuroleptics.
HYPERTROPHY: Growth or increase in size
1998 MRI Studies demonstrate structural BRAIN CHANGES in schizophrenia patients treated with both standard and "atypical" neuroleptic drugs:Non-industry sponsored researchers are coming to realize that this rebound reaction to antipsychotic drugs-both standard and the newer atypicals-- may be so great, it could be causing structural brain changes such as swelling of the brain. Gur, et al., (abstract below) conducted an NIMH-funded MRI imaging study to monitor changes in the size of the basal ganglia and thalamic regions of the brain in schizophrenia patients treated with neuroleptic drugs. They compared them to a group of patients who were never exposed to neuroleptic drugs, and to a group of healthy comparison subjects: As they put it: "Differences between groups and correlations between subcortical volumes and dose of medication indicate that exposure to neuroleptics is associated with HYPERTROPHY...it appears that patients treated with neuroleptics show HYPERTROPHY relative to their neuroleptic-naive counterparts and to healthy comparison subjects."
poster:SLS
thread:55031
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20010221/msgs/55162.html