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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:15:42
I do.
Sometimes it makes me feel uncomfortable.
When I was a teen, I had a friend staying the night. We were putting together something to eat when she leaned over and told me "Your mother is *awful*!" I don't remember the context. Maybe she had blown up in anger, but I'm pretty sure it was behavioral rather than the fact that we had to clean the dead roaches out of our dishes. For some reason this didn't make me feel any better.
My therapist did a quantum shift on my mother a few years ago when my father was dying. He'd always pointed out some of her behaviors here and there over the years, but maintained a bit of that neutrality that comes from knowing that what I'm saying is me filtering her through my lens.
But when she screamed in front of the social worker from the hospice that she wasn't going to have a hospital bed in HER house cluttering it up, and refused to agree to have help in daily despite the fact that Daddy was not at all being kept clean, and Daddy was taken away until the situation at her house was satisfactory, my therapist started to dislike her in earnest. I'm not sure if that pushed a button in his own psyche, or if it was outside objective confirmation of what I've said all along.
Now I find myself mitigating what my therapist says about her. It's not that I don't appreciate his support or his understanding of how... difficult she is. It's more that he doesn't understand that for the first many years of my life she was everything to me. She'd taken me to go live with her parents, so Daddy was mostly a scary stranger. While she did *everything* with me and threw herself into my childish wishes. I see now that that wasn't really for me so much as she enjoyed the contact she had with others, but at the time it was wonderful and magic. And in some ways she really was wonderful and magic. I don't think you could ask for a better mom to little kids.
He also seems to idealize my father's relationship with me a bit. I adored my Daddy. But until I graduated from high school, we weren't particularly close. And he could be difficult as well, as much so in his own way as my mother. I loved him and the relationship we developed was so important to me. I miss him every day. But loving him wasn't an unmitigated joy.
I do point out to my therapist as we go along that he's making me and my father sound too good, and my mother sound too bad. I tell him how I perceive his attitudes.
But I guess I can't make him stop thinking my mother is awful any more than I could change the attitude of my friend.
Posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:21:40
In reply to I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than, posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:15:42
Who's showing black and white thinking here?
grrrr... That annoyed me too. I feel the need to convince him that if anything I spend too much time thinking in greyscale. I catastrophize, yes, but that's only one type of black and white thinking.
And he's always exasperated by my need for absolute precision in my words. He brings me cute little sayings he's heard, and I wrinkle my brow and refine them a bit. He says my versions may be more accurate but they lose their zing and effect. Then he smiles and chooses to be amused by my habitual behavior.
Posted by muffled on December 6, 2007, at 15:10:41
In reply to And come to think of it..., posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:21:40
I like your words dinah.
Anyhow, the sister next to me growing up, was seriously a HAG. I wasn't fond of her... She says so now herself that she was truly awful.
But when my friends would righteously diss her....I would defend her and say, she not so bad, sometimes she nice.
Hmmmm.
Family thing?
I dunno.
M
Posted by star008 on December 6, 2007, at 16:40:25
In reply to I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than, posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:15:42
Dinah,,
maybe your mother was terrible.. maybe he feels the dislike someone feels for someone who has hurt a friend. maybe he had a problem with his own mother?? My T sometimes says things about my mother and I am not totally comfortable with it. I guess we always want to stick up for our parents in some way even if we know it is true? I agree with him though, she was not a good mother by any means.. I am just rambling.. don't know if this is helpful to you or not
Posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 17:50:30
In reply to family » Dinah, posted by muffled on December 6, 2007, at 15:10:41
I think it is my liking of accuracy that forces me into defending her. Yeah, she has her problems, and it's not just me or immediate family who think so. I guess maybe I dislike extremes and would prefer a more moderate view of a human as complex as most humans are.
Posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 17:55:16
In reply to Re: I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than, posted by star008 on December 6, 2007, at 16:40:25
I think he has the basics of it right. It's the intensity that causes me to pause. I don't think I've ever approached him with any real heat about my mother. Real heat isn't really called for.
Maybe his goal is for me to be hotly angry with her instead of coolly angry.
Or perhaps he intends to force me into seeing her good points by defending her. Which isn't really necessary.
Posted by star008 on December 6, 2007, at 20:59:06
In reply to Re: I think my therapist dislikes my mother more t » star008, posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 17:55:16
DINAH,,
u might be right.. he might be trying to get you to get angry about it.. or trying to see that there were things about her that weren't so bad,,, why don't you ask him and see waht he says?
Posted by MidnightBlue on December 7, 2007, at 0:32:32
In reply to I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than, posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:15:42
Dinah,
YOU got to have people come spend the night? I couldn't have anyone over or go to their house either.
And I still say my Mom sounds like your Mom, just waiting for her to do something like deny my Dad a hospital bed. She would say it costs too much! He has Alzheimers and she already belittles him.
MB
Posted by Dinah on December 7, 2007, at 9:09:07
In reply to Re: I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than » Dinah, posted by MidnightBlue on December 7, 2007, at 0:32:32
I think I was feeling a bit unwell yesterday, not realizing my cold had spread to my ears and made me feel sickish. It made me a bit crabby I think.
In retrospect, I'm trying to see my mother's actions as a result of her being upset that my father was declining so badly. Perhaps wanting to fight against what a hospital bed and sitters would mean.
But at the time, it was hard to feel that compassionate. Especially given the usual tone of their relationship.
Posted by MidnightBlue on December 7, 2007, at 10:11:11
In reply to Sigh » MidnightBlue, posted by Dinah on December 7, 2007, at 9:09:07
Dinah crabby? NEVER! As far as the other goes, yes, I can and have "justified" the whys of things, but sometimes it just feels good to get mad.
MB
Posted by Racer on December 7, 2007, at 14:03:08
In reply to I think my therapist dislikes my mother more than, posted by Dinah on December 6, 2007, at 11:15:42
My therapist used to spend a good deal of time pointing out my mother's -- um -- less engaging characteristics, and it upset me, too. I'd be in the middle of crying over something that had happened, or repeating some of the self-talk that I learned at Mother's knee, and my T would stop me to say, "Get ANGRY!" or "Can't you see how narcissistic that was?" Of course, then I'd come racing to the defense, Racer with a Flaming Sword to defend Magical Mother.
One day, my T *finally* caught on: "I wonder if your mother did that out of fear?" Um, yeah -- that's largely what I'd been trying to say for two years...
It's funny -- even though I could see what my T was trying to do, help me get past my guilt at being angry with my mother, since I can't connect to that anger at all -- not even to acknowledge to myself that it's there in the first place -- and even though I know that my T is right about my needing to access that anger, I *still* go into defense mode every time anyone says anything unflattering about my mother. Sometimes, I get frustrated with myself, because even as I acknowledge that my T is dead on accurate about what she's saying, I *still* jump in with that defense.
I think it's partly a sort of natural instinct -- "defend members of the tribe" -- and partly a sort of effort to gain Mother's approval, even if Mother isn't present. But, I could be wrong.
All I know is this: I can say bad things about my mother, but saints preserve anyone who says bad things about her to me! It could be that your therapist is trying to help you access anger you're not acknowledging, or it could be that something has triggered some counter-transference. Or, something else altogether might be involved.
But you're not alone in that sort of reaction, by any means. I hope you've found some sense in my words, because my brain hurts today. I think it'll have to come out...
Posted by rskontos on December 7, 2007, at 15:21:47
In reply to Re: I think my therapist dislikes my mother more t » Dinah, posted by Racer on December 7, 2007, at 14:03:08
Dinah, I might be way off too and I have purposely let my thoughts simmer to see if I changed my mind but when I was reading and re-reading your post I wondered if you weren't trying the analize the analyst to avoid what he might be provoking in you. Maybe like Racer and others were suggesting to defend your mother because we all no matter how bad they might be still defend them. My mother was brutal and cruel and still after she was dead for almost 20 years she had a hold over me. I only just now broke it and can see her more clearly. I don't defend her but need my T to point out how bad her actions were. I only now can discuss how bad she was with my other sibling. I can only now believe my sister when she relates what she remembers. Before when she told me stuff that my mother did I DIDN'T BELIEVE her my own sister. I do now. The hold has been broken. I am not saying your mother was this bad just that we all can not want to know how bad their behavior was cause it hurts and in recognizing it we then must deal with that. And we don't want to. So I think it isn't necesarrily that he dislikes her he just wants to make sure you know what she did was unacceptable and to deal with the aftermath now not later in 5 or 10 years. It isn't always why they did what they did but how did it make you feel and have you dealt with it. I know why my mother did what she did, she was ill and had no help and should have been in the hospital not trying to care for three children. Now I have to deal with how it messed me up. And how I feel about that now. Because it is affecting my life. I think your T just wants to make sure it isn't affecting your life negatively.
Maybe I am wrong too. JMHO......take care......take care of yourself. rsk
Posted by Racer on December 7, 2007, at 16:19:43
In reply to Re: I think my therapist dislikes my mother more t, posted by rskontos on December 7, 2007, at 15:21:47
You know, it just crossed my mind that there's another reason my therapist won't let the Mom Stuff rest: sooner or later, I have to grieve for what I missed as a child. I have to accept that I never had the safety nor security that children are entitled to, that I will forever lack the support and protection I needed and deserved, and, once accepted, I'll have to go through all the pain associated with the grieving process. *That* is something else I am avoiding as best I can -- I don't want to face that agony, and so I defend my mother, so that I can avoid feeling my own pain.
I am not, of course, suggesting that there's anything similar in your situation. Just offering something more to think about.
By the way, if you'd like to dip your toes in, the water here at De Nile is just fine...
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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