![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
My T: Life isn't a sh*t sandwich.
Me: No, it is a double decker sh*t sandwich, because if it looks like sh*t, smells like sh*t, acts like sh*t, it probably is .
My T: So what are you going to do about it?
Me:Fire you *ss for telling me it isn't what it is.
Then another thing, he says something really ballsy and looks away to not see my reaction. What the hell is that? Self protection from countertransference?
T plays my recorded message (looks down, away) then asks
My T: SO are you calling me a liar? (looks away)
Me: no, but I thought you were so busy inorder to not see me because you think I am too dependent on you.
My T: So you ARE calling me a liar. (looks right at me)
(my thoughts in my head)- well you did say you were a very good liar once. Me: No, I didn't call you a liar.
My T: well if I thought you were too dependent and didn't need to see me, I would tell you, not play games. (well I guess I now I know)
Bad jokes
My T: So what are you going to pay me? You house title? well I hear it isn't worth anything....
Yeah, Ha ha ha
I said, You are lucky you are so cute to get away with saying such stuff.
My T: Yeah, I gotten a long way on my cuteness.
Is this why it is so easy to love our T's and not like them at the same time.
Posted by muffled on May 25, 2007, at 9:08:29
In reply to Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
Your T sounds real nice HF and I like that he can be direct.
But he human and got flaws too. There is gonna be tranferrance and stuff.
Those T's, despite themselves cannot help but bring their own stuff into the session.
They are people trying to help people.
Sometimes it scares the crap outta me, that I am trusting my T to keep me OK. Who the hell IS this woman? that I should trust her?
Sometimes I love her, sometimes I think she gotta be a world class idiot.
T is very intense. Hard. I sometimes wonder, its sorta like meds, you have to decide whether the side effects are worth the benefits cuz T is so hard.
I guess since I not good at being around people , that its a good exercise in learning to be around others, and to let them closer to me.
And my T not run from me. She still not run. I can't get over it.
T is weird.
Sigh.
Theres another rant.
Hope you can get some good T work done, your T sounds nice HF.
M
Posted by muffled on May 25, 2007, at 9:08:32
In reply to Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
Your T sounds real nice HF and I like that he can be direct.
But he human and got flaws too. There is gonna be tranferrance and stuff.
Those T's, despite themselves cannot help but bring their own stuff into the session.
They are people trying to help people.
Sometimes it scares the crap outta me, that I am trusting my T to keep me OK. Who the hell IS this woman? that I should trust her?
Sometimes I love her, sometimes I think she gotta be a world class idiot.
T is very intense. Hard. I sometimes wonder, its sorta like meds, you have to decide whether the side effects are worth the benefits cuz T is so hard.
I guess since I not good at being around people , that its a good exercise in learning to be around others, and to let them closer to me.
And my T not run from me. She still not run. I can't get over it.
T is weird.
Sigh.
Theres another rant.
Hope you can get some good T work done, your T sounds nice HF.
M
Posted by peddidle on May 25, 2007, at 13:17:25
In reply to Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
> Is this why it is so easy to love our T's and not like them at the same time.
In a word: yes. It just occurred to me that this relationship (at least the one I have with my T, and the one I think you have with your's) is a lot like ones I have with my friends. Sometimes they do or say things that really annoy me, but I still love them anyway. When that strong underlying bond is there, it takes a h*ll of a lot to break it. You can argue with them, but you'll talk to them the next day, or even an hour later, and it will be like nothing ever happened.
I've never gotten into an argument, per se, with my T, but she has certainly tried to get me to argue with her. After taking psych this past semester, I know that the arguing is part of the cognitive therapy technique. I can't say I've noticed her looking away after saying something-- I usually only notice if she's looking at me when I peek back after not looking at her for a while, and if she's still looking at me, she cracks a smile.
She has certainly tried her share of bad jokes, though, too. We can joke around with each other because we have the same sense of humor, although I don't go after her as much. Some of the jokes make me a little mad at her. Once I walked in and she said, "so, I just got off the phone with your mom..." She told me she was joking right away, but she could see how terrified I was. She, of course, reassured me that she would never call my parents without my permission, etc. and I know she wouldn't. Then she asked me if I wanted to tackle her. I said no, but I kind of did. Several weeks ago, she said she wished she could just open me up and walk around inside my head (I hardly talk, and when she asks me what I'm thinking, my usual answer is "I don't know.") I told her she really doesn't want to do that, because she'd never find her way out. I've never seen her laugh harder. That actually kind of back-fired on me, though, because she said that I must have some understanding of how my mind works if I am able to make a joke like that.
So, my point is that the therapist/client relationship is certainly unique, but it shares many qualities with other relationships. So maybe some of his "games" as just one aspect of your special relationship. They can certainly annoy you and make you want to tackle him, but they're also another reason why you love him.
I'm sorry this got so long, but I hope it helped a little.
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 13:51:51
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head? » Happyflower, posted by muffled on May 25, 2007, at 9:08:29
Hey Muffy Tuffy! ( i hope that is okay)
Your T sounds real nice HF and I like that he can be direct.He is nice and direct, sometimes I just want to shrink in my chair though, he usually isn't THAT direct.... so am I a liar, noooo.... you are a f*cking liar that has ugly legs ! damn!
> But he human and got flaws too. There is gonna be tranferrance and stuff.
> Those T's, despite themselves cannot help but bring their own stuff into the session.
> They are people trying to help people.You say this so well, but kinda is funny when you get under their skin, don't you think? They try so hard, and I think it was tough on him to be tough on me right then. It is like he needed to do it, but didn't want to, but did like a chicken sh*t. LOL
That is okay I can take it though, but geeze I tell my T I think I am really depressed, so he gets on my *ss..... so are you calling me a liar? WTF. I should of said YUP!> Sometimes it scares the crap outta me, that I am trusting my T to keep me OK. Who the hell IS this woman? that I should trust her?
> Sometimes I love her, sometimes I think she gotta be a world class idiot.I can relate to that. I was sure he would throw me out of the room a long time ago! I sure tested the waters with him, and he still was cool about it, even admitted once I did get to him, but he let me come back, without too much crap.
> T is very intense. Hard. I sometimes wonder, its sorta like meds, you have to decide whether the side effects are worth the benefits cuz T is so hard.
I have been in T so long now, I forgot what it feels like to not be in T. I think I like T.
LOL> I guess since I not good at being around people , that its a good exercise in learning to be around others, and to let them closer to me.
My T says our relationship is a practice one. But I hate he said that even if it is true because then I struggle with yeah, he is being fake, and yeah my feelings aren't real. UGGGH!
> And my T not run from me. She still not run. I can't get over it.
> T is weird.Yup! I think your T is in for the long haul with you, not that it will be long, but at least until you are done. I wish my T would take walks with me outside,,,,, you are such a lucky ducky.
> Sigh.
> Theres another rant.Good! I like rants, I think we need to , don't you?
> Hope you can get some good T work done, your T sounds nice HF.Yeah, it is work, but I am glad I have him to help. He is nice, smart and so damn good looking . That just isn't right to have all of that. Thanks Muffy so much.
>
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 14:00:26
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by peddidle on May 25, 2007, at 13:17:25
> In a word: yes. It just occurred to me that this relationship (at least the one I have with my T, and the one I think you have with your's) is a lot like ones I have with my friends. Sometimes they do or say things that really annoy me, but I still love them anyway. When that strong underlying bond is there, it takes a h*ll of a lot to break it.
I never thought about it like that, but yeah, you are right. I guess it is a strong bond, but it also helps that we pay them too, or my T might have in real life told me to go bite a big one by now. LOL But then again he still might, because I told him that once joking around.
.I can't say I've noticed her looking away after saying something-- I usually only notice if she's looking at me when I peek back after not looking at her for a while, and if she's still looking at me, she cracks a smile.
>Oh, you are so cute, no wonder your T smiles. :-)
> She has certainly tried her share of bad jokes, though, too. We can joke around with each other because we have the same sense of humor, although I don't go after her as much.
My T and I joke around a lot too, we like the same humor, even if it is very weird. LOL
Several weeks ago, she said she wished she could just open me up and walk around inside my head (I hardly talk, and when she asks me what I'm thinking, my usual answer is "I don't know.") I told her she really doesn't want to do that, because she'd never find her way out. I've never seen her laugh harder.
That is a good one peddiddle, you and I sound like we might have simular humor too, like our T's,
That actually kind of back-fired on me, though, because she said that I must have some understanding of how my mind works if I am able to make a joke like that.
She probably is right. I told my T that he is always right, and then he said , "No I am not always right, just USUALLY right.
>
> So, my point is that the therapist/client relationship is certainly unique, but it shares many qualities with other relationships. So maybe some of his "games" as just one aspect of your special relationship. They can certainly annoy you and make you want to tackle him, but they're also another reason why you love him.
> I'm sorry this got so long, but I hope it helped a little.Thanks peddidle, it was nice to hear about your experience. It does help me. ;-)
Posted by DAisym on May 25, 2007, at 16:27:34
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head? » muffled, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 13:51:51
>>>>My T says our relationship is a practice one. But I hate he said that even if it is true because then I struggle with yeah, he is being fake, and yeah my feelings aren't real. UGGGH!
<<<<If I may...perhaps "practice" might mean this is a safe relationship because you have such a strong bond and because the social expectations are so different -- not that it is fake, like a "practice test." More like practicing walking for a baby - the baby can't fake walk - but his/her steps are unsteady and they need something to grab on to when they feel they are falling. And we don't start babies out walking on a high wire, or across a busy street. We let them practice in a safe place -- like therapy.
I believe that your therapist cares about you, it isn't fake. Your feelings are real. The cool thing about therapy is that you can talk about them and have them at the same time. (OK, it isn't always cool, but it is supposed to be.:)
I'm sorry you had a hard session. I too would have been mortified if my therapist ever played a message I left for him. But the good part is that he cares about what you think and he wants you to trust him.
Therapy can be so hard!
Posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 17:04:51
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by DAisym on May 25, 2007, at 16:27:34
i think it's hard because he *does* care... i don't think genuine caring about a client should be entirely grouped as counter-transference.. i think he was pissed and probably a little hurt..*because* he cares. Same reason why he looked away... maybe he felt a little too comfortable about how much you could or should trust him.. maybe he thought it would bridge the depression and it didn't. Not your fault. Depression changes how we think and feel.
having said that... and from the relationship you describe that you have with him.. i think you might have smirked a bit inside that his knickers were all in a knot. Am i right?
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 17:19:39
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by DAisym on May 25, 2007, at 16:27:34
<<<<If I may...perhaps "practice" might mean this is a safe relationship because you have such a strong bond and because the social expectations are so different -- not that it is fake, like a "practice test."
Hi Daisy,
It is so nice of you to respond to my post. :-)
You know he did say practice relationship, but now that you reminded me, he did say it was a "safe" relationship too, where I can try things out with him with being safe at the same time.More like practicing walking for a baby - the baby can't fake walk - but his/her steps are unsteady and they need something to grab on to when they feel they are falling. And we don't start babies out walking on a high wire, or across a busy street. We let them practice in a safe place -- like therapy.
Wow, I really like this analogy about therapy, and it makes me feel better about what he said. Thank you.
>
> > I'm sorry you had a hard session. I too would have been mortified if my therapist ever played a message I left for him. But the good part is that he cares about what you think and he wants you to trust him.You know I kinda laugh about this, but it is almost like he was a father trying to teach me a lesson the hard way, but a gentle way. LOL Now I don't see him as a father figure, but knowing what it is like to be a mother when you have to disapline your kids, and it hurts you sometimes have to do it, it seemed like he was really stuggling a little to play the message
for me, almost like it was difficult to "disipline" me.He likes to be a "nice guy" and he had to be not so nice even if it was for my own good. So it makes me laugh because It make me wonder how he is like as a father because he told me he was indulgent
father. ( i bet his daugher gets away with everything, lol)But the weird thing is that I saw how vunerable hewas to do this, he was kinda worried about my reaction I think, because it could really backfire. But he trusted me enough to try it. But it was a sweet tender moment. When I said I was sorry, he seems really happy I apologized and he so sweetly accepted it . awwwwww!
Therapy can be so hard!
It is so hard, but maybe the harder it is the more of a bond I feel with him. and I didnt' think it could get stronger but it did. Thank you Daisy, it means a lot to me you would write to me. Thanks.
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 17:31:17
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head, posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 17:04:51
> i think it's hard because he *does* care... i don't think genuine caring about a client should be entirely grouped as counter-transference.. i think he was pissed and probably a little hurt..*because* he cares.
Yeah, he does care, and he did get a little pissed I think I do know him very well, but I wasn't trying to hurt him, but I knew my message would ruffle his feathers a little. I know he does care what I think.
I guess I needed him and I wasn't getting what I needed from him, so I acted out, but I truely was trying to reach out to the one person who I know whould help me, and he wasn't available, so it pissed me off. It pissed me off he couldn't see me and it pissed me off that I felt so dependent on him.Same reason why he looked away... maybe he felt a little too comfortable about how much you could or should trust him.. maybe he thought it would bridge the depression and it didn't. Not your fault. Depression changes how we think and feel.
I don't understand what you are saying here. Can you explain it to me because I think I get it but not sure.
> having said that... and from the relationship you describe that you have with him.. i think you might have smirked a bit inside that his knickers were all in a knot. Am i right?
Well I knew it would get to him, but when I saw how hurt he seems to be that I didn't believe him, it kinda made me sad I said what I did. I don't enjoy hurting anyone, even if it seems like I do it intentionally, but then again, my thinking is working at the best right now. But no, I didn't snicker, I felt bad and I still feel kinda guilty about it. Thanks Gazo, I appreciate it as always. I hope to see you in chat tonight to hear about your job. ;-)
Posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 18:38:29
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head » gazo, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 17:31:17
"Same reason why he looked away... maybe he felt a little too comfortable about how much you could or should trust him.. maybe he thought it would bridge the depression and it didn't. Not your fault. Depression changes how we think and feel."
sure.. i'll try to clarify. what i am trying to say and maybe it still won't come out quite right.. but i know you trust him, and he does too, maybe he thought that would be enough even when you got depressed... you were distressed and felt needy and then bad about that, i understand why you felt and acted as you did.. being depressed over-rode your trust or faith in him, i don't think he expected that.
i dunno.. maybe that still doesn't get it across.. but i'm an idiot anyway. i hope it didn't offend you HF... what i was trying to say was actually really benign.
much love and peace
Posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 18:41:00
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head » gazo, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 17:31:17
sorry.. one other thing.. about the snicker. i am sorry. i was misreading.
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 18:53:33
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head, posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 18:41:00
HI Gazo,
Thanks for clarifing for me. That is an interesting thought. He has said things before when I would get crazy thoughts about him(usually anger or trust), that he wasn't expecting that from someone he has been working together so long. So that could be it. Thanks Gazo!
Posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 18:56:48
In reply to Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
oh happy... did i mess up? did i upset you? it all came out wrong somehow. i am so sorry. i am. so sorry...:o(
Posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 18:59:03
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head » Happyflower, posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 18:56:48
> oh happy... did i mess up? did i upset you? it all came out wrong somehow. i am so sorry. i am. so sorry...:o(
??????? No you didnt' do anything, did I say something to make you think that? I really appreciate every thing you said! ;-)
Posted by gazo on May 25, 2007, at 19:39:54
In reply to Re: Does you T do stuff that messes with your head » gazo, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 18:59:03
no.. just me. i am hypersensitive i guess... and things come out wrong..thnx for not being mad
Posted by twinleaf on May 29, 2007, at 18:47:29
In reply to Does you T do stuff that messes with your head?, posted by Happyflower on May 25, 2007, at 7:14:15
I think he IS messing with your head a bit right now. Probably not exactly on purpose, but still. What stands out in the snippet of conversation you told us is that it seems to be a lot more about him, than it is about you. I guess that happens a bit in almost all therapy situations, but it isn't helpful to you when it does occur. I hope it's just a fluke, and that he returns to being the good therapist he has always been for you. Keep us updated?
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.