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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by annierose on February 10, 2007, at 18:00:23
Dream 1: I was instant messaging a friend early on Friday morning (something I rarely do). My friend asked me "Don't you have therapy this morning?" Realizing I got my times messed up I jumped in my car and called my t letting her know that I was going to be late. I remember feeling so agitated. T said, "Okay. But I wanted to let you know that someone was attacked in the staircase yesterday so don't take the stairs." I took the stairs anyway and remember wandering through different offices trying not to get attacked. - End of dream one
Dream 2 (dreamed on the same night).
I'm in my t's waiting room. It's a different room than the "real life" one - not as private. My t comes out to get me. As I'm getting up to go with her, another client walks into the room. My t looks at him and say, "You're 30 minutes early. Our appointment isn't until 10 a.m." He says, "No problem, I'll just chill." I turn my head to see who the client is. It's a tatoo'd teenager, with purple spiky hair and various body piercings. In my dream I'm worried for my t and also mad that she said that he was 30 minutes early when my appointments are 45 minutes. - end of dream 2.
I'm open to interpretations.I think the first one seems more clear to me --- that therapy is not safe? And the second one -- that my t isn't safe?
Posted by Honore on February 10, 2007, at 19:30:15
In reply to Two short therapy dreams ..., posted by annierose on February 10, 2007, at 18:00:23
It's hard to interpret dreams without having more details about the dreamer, but I'll try.
In the first dream, your T tells you it's dangerous to take the stairs. You take them anyway. This suggests to me that your T might be telling you something about how to protect yourself, but you ignore her, and can't "find" her, and are left trying to protect yourself from the danger she's made you aware of. -- Yet it's not clear what the danger is, or even if there really is any danger, other than taking the route that you took. (It's not clear if she's right about whether the danger still exists--which I guess might be why you took the stairs anyway.) (Do you usually take the stairs or an elevator; are you afraid of or do you dislike the stairs? or prefer them? how high a floor is your T on?)
The second dream is hard to make sense of, without knowing more. How do you feel about men, body piercings & tatoos, and other patients in general.
In the first dream, you IM a friend; in the second dream, there's a stranger competing for or trying to usurp your time. Your T accommodates him at your expense. He's a stranger because not only do you not know him, but he's strange: he has purple spiky hair, etc.
To me, people with purple spiky hair, piercings and tatoos, are not only strange, they're slightly repellent, and/or as you say, scary.
The first dream could be the dream of your T as a friend and protector (ie she could "be" the friend you can IM); the second dream could be your T as either rejecting, abandoning (she gives away your time) or just strange (ie she could be the weird stranger to whom she caters). Or you could see yourself as somehow a stranger to yourself-- ie the other patient is weird and somehow unattractive; so your T might be someone who sees rather odd people, one of whom is you.
You also seem to be in danger in both dreams, and maybe your T is in danger in the second, but she might feel comfortable or even well- disposed to the spiky guy (as a competitor to you, or even "as" you-- in which case, could she be taking some comfort from your "strangeness"--ie you become strange, at your expense, and to her benefit)-- or maybe she is intimidated and placating him. (Or, on the other hand, perhaps she's making room for a strange part of yourself that you yourself would prefer to ignore-- or disavow-- and giving it "your" time. It's not clear.)
Also, in the first dream, you're in danger of losing her because you "forget" her; in the second dream, you're in danger of losing her because it isn't "private" and you're intruded upon and your time is given away (ie she seems to forget you). Or you might be in danger of losing yourself-- ie the usual self that you know.
Don't know. I like the dreams, especially together, since they are so very complementary.
Honore
Posted by Daisym on February 11, 2007, at 0:39:01
In reply to Two short therapy dreams ..., posted by annierose on February 10, 2007, at 18:00:23
I like all the things Honore thought of. I'm wondering if the first one isn't somehow connected to all the "attacks" on your time lately and how hard it has been to just get to therapy. It does seem like your therapist did warn you about something and you ignored her - but I can't get a feel for why you made the choice to take the stairs. Was reaching her more urgent than your safety?
In the other dream I can't help but wonder if some part of you that you are afraid of is beginning to show up during sessions. This part seems very different than you, and it feels dangerous (to you) for your therapist. Is it possible that you are worried about how acceptable all the parts of you are to her? And now "you" don't have enough time -- but time for what? I suspect that the part that needs to be soothed and reassured is feeling short changed for this restless, rebellious teenager.
Will you tell her your dreams?
Posted by toetapper on February 11, 2007, at 10:56:33
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ... » annierose, posted by Honore on February 10, 2007, at 19:30:15
Hey, I have spiky hair, piercings and tattoos and *I'm* not strange! Oh, wait a minute...
: >)
> To me, people with purple spiky hair, piercings and tatoos, are not only strange, they're slightly repellent, and/or as you say, scary.
Posted by muffled on February 11, 2007, at 13:24:43
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ... » Honore, posted by toetapper on February 11, 2007, at 10:56:33
Posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:09:47
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ... » annierose, posted by Honore on February 10, 2007, at 19:30:15
WOW Honore - you have given me so much to think about! I like how you and Daisy are able to go beyond the concrete and think in the abstract --- I don't think I'm good at that at all.
When I told my therapist the dreams (they happened on Thursday night) she didn't have anything to say --- which isn't like her --- so I posted here wanting more analysis. Thank you.
My t's office is on the second floor, but in the dream the office building was much taller. And I always take the staircase IRL. And on Fridays, IRL, I ALWAYS run into the "stalker client" --- usually in the hallway or on the staircase. It's becoming more and more annoying seeing her. In fact, sometimes I walk around the building just so I don't have to see her.
The idea that the spiky hair individual could be the parts of me that I don't like is interesting. Maybe I only wanted to give "her" 30 minutes of my time that day.
Thank you for giving me so much to think about. Any ideas for the new short dream posted in the same thread?
Posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:26:38
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ..., posted by Daisym on February 11, 2007, at 0:39:01
Yes, I told her the dreams and she didn't say anything. I guess I could have been more direct in soliciting her opinion.
In my dream, I remember thinking to myself that the stairs seemed more safe - afterall - screaming in a staircase is more likely to gather attention than the possibility of being trapped in an elevator. For Annie, it was a common-sense solution.
Your analysis of the "attacks" on my time ring true. My t later in Friday's REAL session ticked me off about more of her input on that subject.
I guess I'm always afraid of certain parts "showing up" in session. And the shame I feel in revealing certain feelings and especially the intensity of them.
Very interesting input as always.
Okay - real life therapy: On Friday she asked more of these random questions. Something she did all week. It makes me wonder what has prompted this sudden change of style. T's self talking, "Maybe I'll start asking her random questions and see where that path will lead us."
Anyway, she asked if I took dance lessons as a child. She asked what other activites I participated in. She asked if I felt bored as a child. THEN --- she says, "Do you think that you are making choices for your children based on your experiences as a child?" I asked her to clarify that question. She did. And I told her I felt a criticism in that. The activites my children do, are driven by them. They are not part of this CRAZY busy children culture. My daughter is only allowed to take ONE sport at a time (right now is nothing) and dance. That's it (besides therapy which is dwindling down to 2x a month). My son has tutoring and kumon (math class - which I required). That's it. Besides friends coming over or me taking them there, the dentist appts, the haircuts, the last minute "I need m&m's for science class" requests, etc. etc.
So I asked, "You know I'm not sure what you are referring to because my life is busy because I do work outside the home and I do have children. Are you thinking about something specifically?"
T: No, you seemed to always doing this, that and other things ...
Can you tell I'm still mad?
Posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:31:58
In reply to Two short therapy dreams ..., posted by annierose on February 10, 2007, at 18:00:23
Okay, I'm sorry but I have never remembered so many dreams before.
Another short therapy dream.
I'm in session at her regular office. I am lying down on her couch and crying. My t asks me what is wrong. I continue crying and say, "The cancer has come back."
She comes over to me (which she would NEVER do in real life) and hugs me and tells me that we will beat this together. She hugs me for a long time and I hug her back. T says, "You kept it away for so long."
For posters: I do not nor never had cancer.
Posted by Daisym on February 12, 2007, at 0:29:15
In reply to Re: ANOTHER 'T' dream - - - what gives?, posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:31:58
I need to think about this but my first thought was that you are struggling with therapy and your therapist. This struggle (and maybe the urge to run from it) could be the cancer. After all you quit before but you promised yourself this time you wouldn't...so maybe?
Just a first thought. Hang in there.
Posted by Honore on February 12, 2007, at 9:34:47
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ... » Honore, posted by toetapper on February 11, 2007, at 10:56:33
Hi, toetapper. Sorry if I put that the wrong way.
Only, maybe that purple hair symbolically could stand for the strange-- in real life, we all know people with purple spiky hair, who are great. It';s a their fashion statement. They do want us to notice, don't you think? :)
Honore
PS One of my best friends has spiky hair... (although it's not purple, but is dyed a rather unusual black color)
Posted by Honore on February 12, 2007, at 9:59:41
In reply to Re: ANOTHER 'T' dream - - - what gives?, posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:31:58
AHaving so many dreams directly about your T (as distinct from dreams about her, in disguised form) seems meaningful, in itself.--
Maybe you're moving into a new phase-- or a phase of clearer or more direct recognition of things.
It's amazing that you had these dreams. Then you had a session where you and your T seemed not to be communicating. She was asking seemingly "random" questions, and bringing up topics that you hadn't-- such as one that was seemingly critical of how you were raising your children.
Maybe that's part of, or somehow connected to, what she's trying to tell you that you don't hear. Maybe she isn't being critical so much as trying to warn you about some danger to you--- either in how you were raised (?) or how you're raising your children (?)? Or?? something else??
I'm not sure what it means, but the first two dreams show this estrangement, or disconnection-- and then this third one shows a sense of intense need for a connection, that she hasn't overtly shown you.
The "stalker patient" seems important, too, because she could be a real life version of this "negative" you-- the needy, helpless you who wants your T;s love and comfort, and who you fear (or imagine) might intrude on or push herself onto your T (or you, since it sounds as if she's stalking you as well as your T). Could you be scared of being like her?
The cancer could stand for all sorts of things, but it is scary, and maybe it reveals how scared you are about getting better, or whether you can; and how much you do need your T. Then this need is crosscut with the thought that you'll never get what you need from her..I was thinking that even if it comes across more as if she isn't hearing you, there's something you might be missing-- and misinterpreting;
I've also learned through experience that Ts hear better if you say you aren't hearing them, when there's a potential mutual non-hearing. It corresponds more to their experience of the not-hearing-- also, they think you're the one who's paying them to help you work on your stuff, so your non-hearing is the non-hearing that's crucial-- at least, as I say, I've found that they tend to believe this pretty strongly. It's at least a place to start to address any non-hearing that's going on.
You're lucky to have dreams that are telling you so much, annierose.
Honore
Posted by Honore on February 12, 2007, at 10:14:53
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ... » Daisym, posted by annierose on February 11, 2007, at 19:26:38
Hi, annierose. One other thought on rereading this.
You do seem to be avoiding something--- something that would attack you or the therapy, as Daisym says-- maybe that your fear of being needy, or showing this intense need that you talk about, is attacking the therapy..
You see t his patient whom you don't want to look at-- there's something about her that's too hard to see-- by the way, I hate to say this because it's just my personal association, but I've heard that people sometimes call cancern "c"-- and I wonder if it's something about something scary that you also don't want to see.
The dreams seem so much about being on the verge of seeing or recognizing or feeling something.
And I do think that could lead to your getting angry at your T-- and distancing yourself-- temporarily "giving up" on her ability to empathize or connect with your inner experience.
She's asking these aimless question about your RL, not interested in your dreams; she says you're too busy, as if criticizing your life choices; it sounds as if, in this seemingly simple moment in therapy you experienced the claustrophobia of the encapsulated elevator. You are walled off from her, in some way, in that moment from any help--from your T. She can't hear your screaming for help.
Sometimes these "average" moments hold a lot of suppressed emotion. And Ts can participate in acting out emotional scenarios of non-connection, in which they really don't connect-- they're invested enough to become unwitting actors in our internal drama.
You sound as if you could pull away from her; I hope you don't'.
Honore
Posted by annierose on February 12, 2007, at 17:18:01
In reply to Re: Two short therapy dreams ..., posted by Honore on February 12, 2007, at 10:14:53
Thanks again for taking the time to think so throughly about this.
I had a real session with my t this morning and we worked through some of this.
My head is swirling with so much information so I'll try to be as brief as possible. I told my T again how criticize I felt over her comment about my children's lives and about the new dream.
T: You mentioned my tone sounded critical and I'm sorry. I had a cold so maybe that added to my mood. But I actually was giving you a compliment. I was pointing out how as an adult you made different choices for yourself and your children. (we discussed this some - - - then)
I think that automatic feeling that pops up as soon as something feels critical goes back to how you were brainwashed as a child that you didn't matter. So either you stayed in your room to avoid the fray or if you joined your family, you were teased and criticized. With that as the backdrop of the way you view the world, it's "the" reason you are in therapy. If that didn't happen to you, you wouldn't be here. I see my job as helping to de-brainwash that chatter.
I told her how sad that made me feel, hearing her say that. She said that I had empathy for myself, and that is a good thing.
We talked about all 3 dreams. She agreed that the spiky teen could represent the rebellious me. She asked me a lot of questions about cancer and my feelings around cancer. I think you and Daisy did a better job of figuring the dreams out than she did! And maybe my t is interested in the dreams, but wants me to come up with my own intrepretations.
She apologized again that I sat with these emotions over the weekend. I wanted to say, "What else is new?" Don't we always?
I don't think it's her. I know this is my stuff coming to therapy.
>>>Sometimes these "average" moments hold a lot of suppressed emotion<<< --- Isn't this the truth!!
I won't pull away from her forever. I have done that before and came back. I'm just doing the push/pull part right now and I wish I could snap out of it. I doing better - thank you.
Posted by annierose on February 12, 2007, at 17:20:11
In reply to Re: ANOTHER 'T' dream - - - what gives? » annierose, posted by Daisym on February 12, 2007, at 0:29:15
I did share that thought w/T this morning. She agreed that could be the "cancer". Funny, she gave me some of her thoughts on the dreams and I can't remember much of what she said.
I think she does understand me. She gets it even if it takes us a session or two to understand where we were coming from.
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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