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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
Planning termination. We didn't even make a schedule today. We talked about why I asked my husband to cal him after my last app't - which was nearly a month ago. I'll see him again in two weeks, and then we'll talk about how to terminate, what I want the schedule to be. Thinking about it makes me cry. Newflash there, right?
I know, I just keep repeating the same thing: this hurts. I know I have the skillls to live life after therapy. I know my T has to let me go, that it's the right thing to do. I know I don't need him anymore. I know I'm a grown woman. I know I know I know.
And I have to figure out how to gentle the hurt. How to soothe myself. How do I do that? How do I hold myself in my own arms? I can be your warm shawls, soft socks; I can be the soup maker, the baby-holder, the day-saver for my friends, but how can I do that for myself? How do I hold myself close and comfort my Self?
Shortelise
Posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 0:51:54
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
I know you know this but...
Even gentle grief is still grief. There are tears to be cried and bittersweet memories to be stored away. Sort of like fall, when we pack things away and wrap ourselves up against the change in the air.
The best way to hold yourself is to let yourself go. Go to your husband and your friends. Small children can be very soothing too.
I know you like to garden -- can you plant a therapy memory garden? It will give you something to focus on and to tend, as you grieve. Choose the flowers and plants carefully, to remind you of the different parts of your therapy experience: something with thorns, something soft and beautiful, something strong and something that reblooms again and again.
Throw a few daisies in too, if you like. We are hearty and make good filler. :)
My turn to hold you in my heart tonight. I hope it helps.
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on April 5, 2005, at 10:24:44
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
ShortE,
I can sure relate,I'm in the process as well. Sometimes I feel my T is pushing me away and that hurts. I know it's for my own good. I wonder though if they dislike doing it.
However, I try to think of it in terms of his pushing me away is part of his professionalism. And aren't I lucky to have a therapist who can recognize when I'm done instead of holding onto me for a steady payment or for personal reasons because he finds me amusing. I am lucky to have such a professional and ethical T who looks out for MY best interests.
I can say this all I want but it still is a little painful.
(((shorte)))
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 11:52:07
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 0:51:54
I just reread what I wrote and I see that the question I wanted to ask is not really part of the what I wrote. What I am wondering is how I am going to be my own therapist, how am I going to work through the crap that happens?
I can't believe it - I have an aura, a migraine coming. A great big blurry blob right in the middle of my field of vision.
We love Daisies, had about ten sorts in our garden last year. This year I am planting a hummingbird garden, lots of perennials. ANd daisies, lots of daisies.
Thanks Daisy. I like the idea of a memory garden - somewhere secret, like in a back corner, some scented shade plants. I like that idea a lot.
ShortE
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 12:04:44
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by Miss Honeychurch on April 5, 2005, at 10:24:44
There is such a shortage of psychiatrists here, and mine is very specialized, that he doesn't need the money he is paid for seeing me - it's paid for by our wonderful Canadian health care system. I love that money doesn't enter into my relationship with my T. All medical docs are paid for, but not psychologists, etc.
The pushing away bit *is* hurtful. But also necessary. Otherwise, I'd just sit there every other Monday for the rest of my life.
I think I need an affirmation. "I am a whole person who grows daily." That's a good one! "I am a respectful, respectable adult who deals calmly and gently with myself and others." I think I'm on a roll.
Two things I really fear are that I'm not going to continue to grow, and that I am not going to be able to cope with the crisis that arise.
Have to go now and cope with the migraine that is about to start. Dammit.
Thanks so much, Miss. I appreciate knowing I'm now alone.
ShortE
Posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 12:27:51
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by Miss Honeychurch on April 5, 2005, at 10:24:44
One of the things I'm working hard on in therapy is NOT being my own therapist...but instead, acknowledging how I'm feeling and knowing when to accept support from friends and family. I have to trust the people that I care about to help me process the crud...and I have to use the skills I'm learning now to "learn from it and then let go of it." (OK, long way from that right now, it sounds good.)
Your therapist is not sending you out into the cold world alone. He knows you've built up inner strength and resilience AND you've learned to lean on other people, to trust them. This is so huge.
I think you are feeling out of balance because there will be a hole for a while. I'm guessing it is a process of filling that space with other nurturing folks.
You can do this. He has faith that you are ready. So do I...
And it isn't forever, you know. IF you find you need tune ups, you need a therapeutic perspective, not just support from friends and family, he'll be there for you. It isn't the same, I know. But it *is* something.
I'm glad you liked the garden idea. I just put some daisies in my yard too. They make me smile.
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 12:51:43
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 12:27:51
I'm still here as I had to write and send an invoice...
I am *too* dependant, so I need to learn to do this stuff for myself.
I am hoping to see him every, I don't know, three weeks, for maybe a few months, then every month for six months, then every two months for six months. Is that possible? (Of course, I am starting to cry. Migraine doesn't help. Meds kicking in.) It has to be gradual, gradual enough that I feel he is still there, like the children who have to keep checking back that Mom is still at the kitchen table, peeling potatoes or writing her thesis.
I need to be my own center, I need a place in myself where I can go and find counsel. Solace. Safety. Validation. Yes, I can get all of those things from my husband and friends, but for me, I need that from inside. It's coming. Slowly.
Thanks Daisy. Now I am going to go and fid a dark quet place and hope I don't have to take percocet. The migraine meds don't take the whole day away, but the painkillers, when I have to resort to them, do.
ShortE
Posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 13:15:36
In reply to Re: Mourning » daisym, posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 12:51:43
I'm sorry about the head ache. I hope dark and quiet have helped.
I think your plan is a good one. I've often said lately that the empathy I feel now for childen suffering separation anxiety is deep and real. I'm glad I didn't feel this when my children were little, I would never have been able to work.
I get what you are saying about needing your own strong core. But can I point out that when I pushed you, even a little, you showed me that you know what you need? AND you said you've developed it, at least the beginnings of it -- an internal counsel, the ability to hear your own voice in your head and trust it. I guess you just have to have faith this voice will grow louder and stronger.
I know this is impossibly hard. I wish I knew how to help. I hope I'm not saying the wrong things and making it worse. That balance of internal strength and external support is really hard to find and keep.
If nothing else, I can sit with you while you cry and give you someone to lean against.
Posted by thewrite1 on April 5, 2005, at 13:22:55
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
My T brings up rather often that I'm learning to be a good mother to myself. Every single time I hear that, I become rather furious. I guess for me I'm still at the stage where I don't want to. No, no, no. Someone else should do it. I've spent my whole life taking care of myself (mostly failing). *tears*
*takes a moment*
Sorry, that was more triggering to me than I could have imagined.
Posted by pinkeye on April 5, 2005, at 14:24:20
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
Take Care ShortE.
Keep yourself busy, and maybe if you can work on a slow termination like you are doing, maybe it will help. I am not really sure though.It hurts a lot, and you can console yourself in all different ways, but at the end, you just have to go through it.. maybe think someone very dear to you has died and that they are not going to come back ever - even if you throw all sorts of fits? I haven't been good through termination myself, so I don't have too much of an advice to offer you.
If you can have another fulfilling relationship maybe that will help.. But I think sometimes nothing can really subsitute a good therapist after leaving him. It is just a hole forever.
Posted by Tamar on April 5, 2005, at 17:49:56
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
Terminating is so hard. The anxiety of having your safety net removed is awful. I don't think it's possible to do it without some pain. Maintaining a connection with your feelings should help some.
Part of being soothed is allowing other people in a little, I think. Let your friends save your day, just like you've saved the day for them. And also take care of yourself: be your own warm shawls and soft socks, and make soup for yourself and make sure you look after yourself.
Terminating takes courage, but you have what it takes. And we'll all be here for you when it's hurting.
(((Shortelise)))
I'll be thinking of you.
Tamar
Posted by pinkeye on April 5, 2005, at 18:45:35
In reply to Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 4, 2005, at 23:42:29
Trying to be a little less serious about things also would help. The best medicine for any suffering is to add some humor and light heartedness into the situation.
But it is not always possible.. especially when there is a profound underlying need. But a little optimism about life - that you will be able to live a good one irrespective of your therapist not being there, might help.
I think they should come up with one of these Quote Books - with little tips and quotes for moving on after therapists.
Finally, realizing that it was jsut a professional relationship and not a personal one - atleast from your therapist's point of view, might help.
These are all mights.. at the end it still is very painful. Just have to have a hard heart and let go however painful it is I think at the end. But at any cost, don't make yourself a nuisance to him. Vent here all you want, but don't try to cling on to him.. it will only end up embarassing you.
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:02:38
In reply to Re: Mourning » Shortelise, posted by pinkeye on April 5, 2005, at 18:45:35
Wow, Pinkeye, you really pushed my buttons here - it's so strange. Yikes. And don't worry - thisis NOT about you - it's about me!
That you say that from his perspective it's "just" a professional relationship bugs me. It's a relationship that's so complicated, and part of the deal is that he care about me and continue to be there should I need him. I don't doubt that. I just don't really neeed him much anymore, darn it all.
The idea that I could ever be a nuisance to him bugs me. I feel that our relationship is in part his creation. But that I would embarass myself, I find the idea humilitaing, and the suggestion that I might do so really kind of gets me.
It makes me sad that my sense of humour doesn't show here. There is nothing, but nothing I do more than laugh. Even in the depth of the worst caca, I find some hideous black sense of humour to go with the circumstances.
I have to say I find it interesting how strongly I reacted to your posts. THanks for writing!
ShortE
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:03:57
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:02:38
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:07:19
In reply to Re: Mourning » Shortelise, posted by daisym on April 5, 2005, at 13:15:36
The headache is gone and I didn't have to resort to major meds.
Thanks for the encouragement. It's so funny to hear that you have that feeling for children and separation anxiety - when I hear children cry - that real, deep, pain-filled crying, I can barely keep it together.
Thanks for pointing out what you did. You are not saying the wrong things at all.
Thanks.
ShortE
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:14:12
In reply to Re: Mourning » Shortelise, posted by thewrite1 on April 5, 2005, at 13:22:55
(((thewrite1)))
I hope you can tell your T that makes you angry. I'm sure you can and do. Mine helped me find a way of coming to it that wasn't so crazy making.
I know just how you feel - or at least I know my own version of it.
It can be exhausting, and it's been such a relief to have someone to share the caretaking with. Now it's easier, much easier, as I have better skills.
*big sigh*
ShortE
Posted by pinkeye on April 5, 2005, at 20:19:38
In reply to Re: Mourning, posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:02:38
Don't take it personally. I might jsut have been in a bad mood and trying to work on my own moving away from my ex T. These are things I try to say to myself, when I have to move on and let go and stop myself from writing to him, so I said to you.. may not even be relevant in your context.
If your therapist never said you are bothering him, and has promised to be there for you all the time, then by all means ignore my posts. I never see my T face to face, so I just tend to imagine lot of stuff - which really may not be true.
Posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:28:23
In reply to Re: Mourning » Shortelise, posted by Tamar on April 5, 2005, at 17:49:56
Tamar, my friends are in, big time. But this isn't a short process. It isn't like having a sick baby where someone can hang around, make meals, do laundry, take care of things off and on for a couple of weeks. It's been going on for years, all this crap and upheaval I've gone through in therapy. Luckily, I am a somewhat interesting, amusing person, and I have some good friends, and a husband who loves me enough to put up with all my crap.
My friends and I go for coffee, talk on the phone, dine, walk, shop and play together. My closest friend is a social worker, my next closest friend is a therapist. They understand. I have support. And I use the support I have, too. It's just - I can't take advantage of them, either.
Yes, I am a little confused. On the one hand, I don't want to burn anyone out, I think I need to be my own warm socks, but I know I need the connections too. Oh, gizzards, I just can't think about it anymore right now. I am going to heat the curry I made last night. Feed the family, and watch a new Turkish film, and hope for sanity.
Thanks very much, Tamar. I really will call my friends for help on the worst of days. I need to do that.
ShortE
Posted by Tamar on April 5, 2005, at 20:58:39
In reply to Re: Mourning » Tamar, posted by Shortelise on April 5, 2005, at 20:28:23
I'm very glad to hear your friends are so supportive, and your husband too. And the good thing about real friends is that they're prepared to hear all the crap over and over, for as long as it takes. You are indeed an interesting and amusing (and generous, compassionate, intelligent, warm...) person; that much is demonstrated in your posts here. So you're not taking advantage if you lean on them through the termination process, however long it takes.
You can call them on the so-so days as well as the worst days, and they, being real friends, won't feel taken-advantage-of. I'm sure you would do the same for them whenever necessary. And on the good days you can stand on your head and drink gin :)
I hope you enjoyed your curry and Turkish film!
Tamar
Posted by Shortelise on April 6, 2005, at 10:49:23
In reply to Re: Mourning » Shortelise, posted by Tamar on April 5, 2005, at 20:58:39
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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