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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 14, 2022, at 22:39:21
Is it?
Posted by Christ_empowered on June 15, 2022, at 7:06:27
In reply to Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on June 14, 2022, at 22:39:21
I never was a big fan of melatonin supplements. I tried...5mgs/nightly, I think...as part of my TD-prevention cocktail, and..
blah. just...no. :-(
but the "alternative" material I've skimmed has always, always, always emphasized the safety and ease of use. as in...no major problems associated with it, also not known for causing any sort of dependence or horrible discontinuation syndrome.
so.???
not to sound like a "conspiaracy theorist," but I've seen this...slant...in mainstream media coverage of fairly innocuous, safe, popular supplements. maybe its part of a campaign to restrict access?
here in the US, there were some random cases of kids being doped to the gills with melatonin by underpaid childcare workers. happens. I mean...how do I put this...
at least it wasn't a barbiturate or a benzodiazepine? I think that's what abusive adults used on kids before those were further regulated. that and...
here in the US, it would be a -good idea- for the gov't to somehow give people who handle our food, care for the kids and elderly and sick, and on and on better pay and better working conditions. to me, that's common sense.
:-)
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 15, 2022, at 8:10:31
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Christ_empowered on June 15, 2022, at 7:06:27
Right, nature based treatments are rarely studied. The fact that there is no scientific evidence would only be meaningful if the would in fact study everything that sounds promising for patients. They obviously don't. They study what is promising for the pharmaceutical industry.
Posted by SLS on June 15, 2022, at 12:01:57
In reply to Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on June 14, 2022, at 22:39:21
> Is it?
I have never heard of melatonin being toxic. However, I reacted to badly to it. My depression moderately worsened.
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 15, 2022, at 12:19:29
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by SLS on June 15, 2022, at 12:01:57
> > Is it?
>
> I have never heard of melatonin being toxic. However, I reacted to badly to it. My depression moderately worsened.
>
>
> - ScottHm. It is being said that Melatonin detoxes body and brain. Some sort of herx? Did it make you sleep?
Posted by SLS on June 15, 2022, at 14:37:36
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on June 15, 2022, at 12:19:29
> > > Is it?
> >
> > I have never heard of melatonin being toxic. However, I reacted to badly to it. My depression moderately worsened.
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> Hm. It is being said that Melatonin detoxes body and brain. Some sort of herx? Did it make you sleep?I don't remember melatonin affecting me that way. The funk I was in felt "yucky" - kind of a malaise.
- Scott
Posted by Jay2112 on June 16, 2022, at 20:35:09
In reply to Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on June 14, 2022, at 22:39:21
> Is it?
Well, yes, it has been proven as a powerful antioxidant. In low doses, you might want to take breaks, because it will eventually lower your body-produced melatonin, and that in itself can be a bit of a muckery.
In high doses, I have read in the scientific literature (much in rodent and animal models, but some anecdotal) that it can a) have an effect on male sperm count and even testosterone b) cause severe depression c) completely mess up natural human body/time rhythms i.e. mess up female menstrual cycles, ruin sleep/awake schedules.
From my own personal use, at very high doses (it was for anxiety, with no meds), yes, it did work, only at times though, for my anxiety, but I lowered into deep depression. Plus, I felt hungover EVERYDAY. And my sex drive just went south!
So, at low doses (lower than 10mg), with occasional breaks, seems fine.
Jay
Posted by SLS on June 17, 2022, at 6:20:38
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term? » Lamdage22, posted by Jay2112 on June 16, 2022, at 20:35:09
> > Is it?
>
> Well, yes, it has been proven as a powerful antioxidant. In low doses, you might want to take breaks, because it will eventually lower your body-produced melatonin, and that in itself can be a bit of a muckery.
>
> In high doses, I have read in the scientific literature (much in rodent and animal models, but some anecdotal) that it can a) have an effect on male sperm count and even testosterone b) cause severe depression c) completely mess up natural human body/time rhythms i.e. mess up female menstrual cycles, ruin sleep/awake schedules.
>
> From my own personal use, at very high doses (it was for anxiety, with no meds), yes, it did work, only at times though, for my anxiety, but I lowered into deep depression. Plus, I felt hungover EVERYDAY. And my sex drive just went south!
>
> So, at low doses (lower than 10mg), with occasional breaks, seems fine.
>
> Jay- Scott
Posted by undopaminergic on June 17, 2022, at 11:05:59
In reply to Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on June 14, 2022, at 22:39:21
> Is it?
I read a mailing list post by someone who claimed that there is some kind of therapeutic window, a sweetspot. In particular, higher doses are not always better, but can be worse. I'm sorry I don't recall any details. Wait, I think I found it:
<<1. Melatonin 300 mcg, 2 hours before bed. Dosage is important(IT IS IN
MICROGRAMS). You can try going up or down in 100 mcg increments to find the
best dose for you. If you're taking too much or too little, you will feel
sleepy till the next afternoon or you could wake up too soon or you could
be sleeping but not in deep sleep.>>And: <<The right dose is very important for melatonin. This is one drug where
less is better. Taking more than 300 mcg will reduce sleep latency
(time to sleep) but would cause you to wake up unnaturally after an
unpredictable amount of sleep. 300 mcg just gives a gentle push to
your system that enhances deep sleep, although its effects on sleep
latency are not so pronounced as higher doses.>>And: <<Several professional bodies, including reputed ones, recommend 1 mg of
melatonin. This is stupid, idiotic, and even harmful. 1 mg is the dose
at which most clinical trials are done. That is because manufacturers
probably don't want to test a small dose whose effects are less
pronounced lest their trial fails to meet the criteria for statistical
significance. But there is enough anecdotal evidence to suggest that
300 mcg is so much better in every way.>>-undopaminergic
Posted by SLS on June 17, 2022, at 21:32:20
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by undopaminergic on June 17, 2022, at 11:05:59
It is perhaps more important to synchronize the timing of dosing melatonin with one's circadian rhythm than it is how much to take. For some people, it turns out that their healthy sleep-wake cycle is maintained by taking melatonin 1-2 hours before bed. However, some people don't get the most out of melatonin unless they take it during the early afternoon. Either way, it is important to take it at exactly the same time every day.
- Scott
Posted by Jay2112 on June 21, 2022, at 22:54:44
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term? - Thanks, Jay. » Jay2112, posted by SLS on June 17, 2022, at 6:20:38
I am no expert, by any means, in the application of melatonin (but hey....thanks :) but I certainly agree with you Scott about the timing. In fact, there should be some kind of test to determine ultimate time to take at.
Peace,
Jay :)
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 27, 2022, at 14:50:13
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term? » Lamdage22, posted by Jay2112 on June 16, 2022, at 20:35:09
Will 4mg Melatonin decrease testosterone long term?
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 31, 2022, at 3:16:01
In reply to Re: Is melatonin safe long term?, posted by Lamdage22 on July 27, 2022, at 14:50:13
My last Testosterone blood test came in low. Any male should not be interested in lowering his testosterone. Especially if the molecule isn't very effective and there are alternatives.
Posted by undopaminergic on July 31, 2022, at 18:12:53
In reply to Im tapering off Melatonin, posted by Lamdage22 on July 31, 2022, at 3:16:01
> Any male should not be interested in lowering his testosterone.
>Testosterone and other androgens, especially dihydrotestosterone, wreak havoc on the skin. I wish I had had access to a substance to reduce androgens back in my teens. I had severe acne and got scars from it. It stimulates hair growth in areas where you don't want it, and destroys hair growth where you do want hair. My brother is getting male pattern baldness. I'm spared from that so far (even though I'm a few years older than him), possibly because I have low testosterone, which I don't know for sure because I haven't tested it. I would be very cautious about supplementing it, even though it may possibly mitigate depression.
-undopaminergic
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