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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 7 to 31 of 31. Go back in thread:
Posted by linkadge on February 20, 2022, at 17:38:39
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on February 20, 2022, at 12:52:57
CBD is pleiotropic (multiple mechanisms) and the mechanism is not completely understood. However some of the known mechanisms include:
-5-ht1a agonism (moderate)
-d2 presynaptic agonist (like abilify)
-gaba-a positive modulator
-indirect sodium channel antagonist
-TRVP-1 agonist (anticonvulsant/analgesic effects)
-inhibits anandamide metabolism by inhibiting fatty acid binding proteins
- not a direct cb1/cb2 agonist, but may indirectly increase receptor activity
-anti-inflammatory effectI use CBD daily, and get a good effect from 20-50mg a day. For me, it completely replaced ativan, and has virtually cured my chronic insomnia, in conjunction with mirtazapine. I purchase dried CBD rich herb, decarboxylate (cook) it using the Ardent decarboxylator, then I grind it measure it out, and then put it in my mouth. Then, I add olive oil (more on this below) and then chew the mixture to help extract / release the CBD. The effects are felt within about an hour. Supposedly, CBD has lowish oral bioavailability. The bioavailability can allegedly be enhanced with piperdine (form black pepper). I add black pepper (which also has cannabinomemetic properties) liberally to my foods throughout the day.
You need to make sure the product is from a reputable source, and I would encourage going right back to the dry herb. Some analysis of various OTC CBD oils has found significant inconsistency in potency as well as THC content.
Olive oil contains oleic acid, which is converted into oleamide. Oleamide (interestingly) has many mechanisms similar to CBD, namely:
-5-ht1a agonism
-Sodium channel inhibition
-d2 presynaptic agonism
-CB1 / CB2 agonismPersonally, if you're on high dose neuroleptics, I wouldn't try replacing them with CBD (unless you can get that synthetic CBD pill). That being said, I would say that 40 mg of CBD would have the sedative qualities of 25-50mg of seroquel. You could probably reduce the dose of your neuroleptic to some extent, but again, you'd need to be confident in the quality of the product you're getting.
If you were in Canada, you're always welcome to stop by for a sample from my system.
Linkadge
Posted by Lamdage22 on February 21, 2022, at 2:29:18
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by linkadge on February 20, 2022, at 17:38:39
Thanks for the offer. Can we also take some Natriumchloride at your place? :) Yeah I may try CBD in a low dose. I will have to look for a trustworthy source-
> If you were in Canada, you're always welcome to stop by for a sample from my system.
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> Linkadge
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Posted by Lamdage22 on February 21, 2022, at 2:29:57
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on February 21, 2022, at 2:29:18
Sorry, sodium chloride :)
Posted by undopaminergic on February 21, 2022, at 8:01:04
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by linkadge on February 20, 2022, at 17:38:39
> CBD is pleiotropic (multiple mechanisms) and the mechanism is not completely understood. However some of the known mechanisms include:
>
> -5-ht1a agonism (moderate)
> -d2 presynaptic agonist (like abilify)
> -gaba-a positive modulator
> -indirect sodium channel antagonist
> -TRVP-1 agonist (anticonvulsant/analgesic effects)
> -inhibits anandamide metabolism by inhibiting fatty acid binding proteins
> - not a direct cb1/cb2 agonist, but may indirectly increase receptor activity
> -anti-inflammatory effect
>Wikipedia mentions:
- allosteric modulation of mu- and delta-opioid receptorsWikipedia also mentions: Cannabidiol has low affinity for the cannabinoid CB1 and CB2 receptors, although it can act as an antagonist of CB1/CB2 agonists despite this low affinity.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Jay2112 on February 21, 2022, at 12:53:09
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on February 21, 2022, at 8:01:04
> > CBD is pleiotropic (multiple mechanisms) and the mechanism is not completely understood. However some of the known mechanisms include:
> >
> > -5-ht1a agonism (moderate)
> > -d2 presynaptic agonist (like abilify)
> > -gaba-a positive modulator
> > -indirect sodium channel antagonist
> > -TRVP-1 agonist (anticonvulsant/analgesic effects)
> > -inhibits anandamide metabolism by inhibiting fatty acid binding proteins
> > - not a direct cb1/cb2 agonist, but may indirectly increase receptor activity
> > -anti-inflammatory effect
> >
>
> Wikipedia mentions:
> - allosteric modulation of mu- and delta-opioid receptors
>
> Wikipedia also mentions: Cannabidiol has low affinity for the cannabinoid CB1 and CB2 receptors, although it can act as an antagonist of CB1/CB2 agonists despite this low affinity.
>
> -undopaminergic
>I think that a big point of contention, that I have heard a number of researchers bring up, though, is the *strength* and efficacy of CBD that is required to produce a noticeable effect in all of the mentioned areas. I have read (this is not *my* opinion) some researchers say that CBD is of very little value without some THC. Like any drug, it is also very, very much divergent based on so many genetic variables.
Like many early researchers did, the only real way to find it's value is to take some yourself...and adjust doses as needed. Seriously, like Albert Hoffman and LSD. (Maybe you'll get lucky to have such a great experience...eerr..trip, too :)
Jay
Posted by linkadge on February 22, 2022, at 15:40:06
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on February 21, 2022, at 2:29:18
>Can we also take some Natriumchloride at your place?
No. Weed is ok, but I draw the line at added salt. That's crossing the addiction precipice.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on February 22, 2022, at 15:42:37
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on February 21, 2022, at 8:01:04
>Cannabidiol has low affinity for the cannabinoid >CB1 and CB2 receptors, although it can act as an >antagonist of CB1/CB2 agonists despite this low >affinity.
Yeah, it may have some mixed agonist / antagonist effects depending on the endocannabinoid level. I remember reading that the anti-anxiety effects could be blocked (in mice) by CB1 antagonists. In some animal models too, it prolongs the synaptic effects of THC.
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on February 22, 2022, at 15:45:56
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Jay2112 on February 21, 2022, at 12:53:09
>some researchers say that CBD is of very little >value without some THC
It can stop a seizure in the absence of THC. Synthetic CBD is an effective anticonvulsant for some forms of epilepsy. The dosage, however, is in the hundreds of milligrams.
This being said, benzos can work for anxiety in doses much lower than anticonvulsant doses. I can get relief from anxiety with 0.25mg of clonazepam. Yet, 2.5mg might be needed to stop a seizure.
If I gave you my product, you'd know it. It may not be the effect you're looking for, but you would notice the effect.
Linkadge
Posted by Lamdage22 on February 23, 2022, at 1:33:00
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by linkadge on February 22, 2022, at 15:40:06
You are right. I wouldnt know how to explain to my narcotics anonymous sponsor.
> No. Weed is ok, but I draw the line at added salt. That's crossing the addiction precipice.
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> Linkadge
Posted by Lamdage22 on February 23, 2022, at 1:44:13
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by linkadge on February 22, 2022, at 15:45:56
I see that Eddie Hall, a Strongman, counts on CBD for recovery. But from what you guys are saying it is not a very profound anti anxiety effect.
Posted by linkadge on March 2, 2022, at 14:19:27
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on February 23, 2022, at 1:44:13
To be honest, CBD (for me) produces a much stronger anti-anxiety effect than any benzodiazapine or SSRI. Medical marijuana (with some THC) has literally erased past fears from my memory. Anxiety is no longer an issue for me, depression is still there to some extent.
Linkadge
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 6, 2022, at 0:45:33
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by linkadge on March 2, 2022, at 14:19:27
Stronger than benzo is impressive.
Posted by undopaminergic on March 6, 2022, at 8:15:11
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 6, 2022, at 0:45:33
> Stronger than benzo is impressive.
Benzos are *not* impressive for anxiety in my experience. Opioids on the other hand...
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 7, 2022, at 14:07:04
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on March 6, 2022, at 8:15:11
I am foreseeing threads about speed balls and similar for mental illness. Not very valuable.
Posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2022, at 12:26:48
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 7, 2022, at 14:07:04
> I am foreseeing threads about speed balls and similar for mental illness. Not very valuable.
>What leads you to expect such threads? Sure, the topic of opioids (especially buprenorphine) for mental illness comes up here from time to time, but in my experience that is rare. I do consider such threads as valuable, on average, as other threads.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 8, 2022, at 12:33:49
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2022, at 12:26:48
Im just concerned because I have seen people get very unwell with that stuff. This forum seems to gravitate towards drugs that are abused by most consumers.
Posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2022, at 14:30:06
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 8, 2022, at 12:33:49
> Im just concerned because I have seen people get very unwell with that stuff. This forum seems to gravitate towards drugs that are abused by most consumers.
>Drugs are abused for a reason. That reason is that those drugs do something good, and do it well, or in other words, they work better than drugs that are rarely (if ever) "abused".
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 4:14:07
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2022, at 14:30:06
I see people in a part of town close to the train station often. They aren't just extremely unwell, they are downright dehumanized. I feel terribly sorry when I see that.
I think we should focus on drugs without the risk of an aftermath like that. If you had two years to live and were in pain, I'd say right on, shoot heroine. But this is not the situation of contributors here.
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 4:22:40
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 4:14:07
These drugs to me are a trasaction, you borrow relief and you pay for it later.
Posted by undopaminergic on March 9, 2022, at 6:26:00
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 4:14:07
> I see people in a part of town close to the train station often. They aren't just extremely unwell, they are downright dehumanized. I feel terribly sorry when I see that.
>A big part of their problem is the high price of drugs, which means they can't afford housing, because their drug of choice takes precedence. Some (maybe even a lot) of them also have problems like schizophrenia.
> I think we should focus on drugs without the risk of an aftermath like that. If you had two years to live and were in pain, I'd say right on, shoot heroine. But this is not the situation of contributors here.
>Depression can be as unbearable as pain, and it can easily be life-threatening.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 6:40:45
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on March 9, 2022, at 6:26:00
I dont know about your nordic country, but in my german speaking country, housing is bound to conditions. Not good. They usually take more drugs on the streets because life on the streets is very tough. And almost anyone can end up on the streets. People tend to say otherwise so they dont feel the obligation to help.
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 10, 2022, at 1:37:26
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 9, 2022, at 6:40:45
I will give you that medical treatments destroyed my health much more so that Marihuana. And not just psychmeds. The reason why I took Marihuana may be medical treatments in the first place. It started with an antibiotic for acne and Roaccutane thereafter. Roaccutane destroys your gut microbiome more so than even antibiotics!!!
Roaccutane is known for causing psychiatric problems. My behavior got much more problematic ever since I took it with 14.
I am not a fan of prohibited substances or "prescription only".
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 10, 2022, at 1:40:08
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 10, 2022, at 1:37:26
I wonder if it is too late to report and if anyone would believe me.
Posted by undopaminergic on March 10, 2022, at 3:37:20
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by Lamdage22 on March 10, 2022, at 1:40:08
> I wonder if it is too late to report and if anyone would believe me.
Report what, to whom?
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on March 10, 2022, at 8:39:28
In reply to Re: Anyone try CBD?, posted by undopaminergic on March 10, 2022, at 3:37:20
Report to health authorities that my psychological problems intensified the minute I introduced Roaccutane into my system. Many people already did. The problem is it was 18 years ago.
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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