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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lamdage22 on October 25, 2021, at 12:51:24
What do you think. Good this give a hint of antidepressant effect and some Gaba-T mediated anxiolysis at 30mg as opposed to too much MAOI at 45mg?
Posted by sigismund on October 26, 2021, at 0:19:07
In reply to 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok?, posted by Lamdage22 on October 25, 2021, at 12:51:24
With Nardil is the relaxation from the first doses?
Posted by SLS on October 26, 2021, at 12:14:43
In reply to 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok?, posted by Lamdage22 on October 25, 2021, at 12:51:24
I don't understand your question.
I have operated on the premise that the effective range of Nardil is 60-90 mg/day. I have only rarely seen someone with depression respond to 30-45 mg/day.
I am currently taking 90 mg/day. I relapse at 75 mg/day.
When starting Nardil, I advocate a very gradual titration to avoid *triggering* significantly more intense side effects. I started off at 7.5 mg/day (1/2 tablet). After being on and off Nardil since 1982, this is the only time that hypotension and urinary retention did not emerge.
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 4, 2021, at 6:18:42
In reply to Re: 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok? » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on October 26, 2021, at 12:14:43
Hm 45 mg was enough to shoot over the target in a psychological way. I seem to be different in that way. I got belligerent, although with reason, but much more than without the med. Maybe I am not belligerent enough right now, as my Psychologist suggests.
I wonder if my depression serves the purpose of lessening aggression. I seem to take too much stuff(interpersonal stuff, not meds). Learning in therapy how not to be manipulated.
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 4, 2021, at 6:20:14
In reply to Re: 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok?, posted by Lamdage22 on December 4, 2021, at 6:18:42
If you are shut down by depression, you are not going to call people off. My theory is that Nardil lessened inhibition too much so it came out in an unhelpful way.
Posted by SLS on December 4, 2021, at 16:22:15
In reply to Re: 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok?, posted by Lamdage22 on December 4, 2021, at 6:18:42
Hi, Lamdage.
> Hm 45 mg was enough to shoot over the target in a psychological way. I seem to be different in that way. I got belligerent, although with reason, but much more than without the med. Maybe I am not belligerent enough right now, as my Psychologist suggests.
>
> I wonder if my depression serves the purpose of lessening aggression. I seem to take too much stuff(interpersonal stuff, not meds). Learning in therapy how not to be manipulated.
When I first began to respond to Nardil, I was aggressive and easy to anger. Now, I would call myself vociferously assertive. What you describe could be the result of several things.1. Normal for a healthy you.
2. An initial exaggeration of a healthy you as the result of not having in place a system of self-discipline and impulse control as you emerge from an inhibiting depresson. This will resolve with time, practice, and probably without intervention.
3. A true hypomanic mixed-state / manic dysphoria triggered by Nardil. In TRD, an alternative to simply discontinuing Nardil is to leave it in place and treat the hypomania. In the case of people who whose hypomania is more euphoric, but who remain happy and functional (hyperfunctional), smart doctors often don't attempt to rock the boat.
4. Nardil is known to produce a hypomania-like state *at first* that fades rather quickly. Many people fall into the trap of thinking that this initial euphoria is what they are supposed to feel, and are forever chasing the lost high. Your initial hypomania-like state might be more angry or rageful than euphoric.
What do you think?
- Scott
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 5, 2021, at 3:05:13
In reply to Re: 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok? » Lamdage22, posted by SLS on December 4, 2021, at 16:22:15
Thanks, Scott. These are all things to think about. But being angry also triggered a psychotic symptoms. Or it came along with that. If Nardil would mean that I need more antipsychotics, I wouldn't do it.
Posted by Lamdage22 on December 5, 2021, at 3:08:16
In reply to Re: 45mg Nardil='psychotic features'. 30=ok?, posted by Lamdage22 on December 5, 2021, at 3:05:13
It is a bit hard to ascertain what caused what. I had times on Nardil where I was doing well. My strategy with my family was to not feel transgressions with the help of depression. At least it could be that way.
This is the end of the thread.
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