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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by B2chica on March 14, 2013, at 12:15:05
i'm going to have to restart perphenazine this weekend. my anxiety is so bad i've been nauseous all week, i'm doing some weird shoulder/neck movement obsessively that is now giving me muscle cramps-aches, and some weird sniffing/snorting tick that i cant take anymore.
its making me want to just lay in my closet...thing is perphenazine works great for a couple months, then seems to bring some depression on.
are there any other solutions out there. and PLEASE dont ask me for zyprexa, im still carrying 30lbs of the weight i gained over the winter from that.
also, every SSRI i've been on i've had manic issues with, so most likely that is not an option.
i take benzo's and they make me...heavy. i dont mind taking them a couple times a week but to do daily i know would start up my depression and feeling like there's cement in my head.
i'm also open to (cheap)herbal supplements.
currently on:
Pristiq 100mg
adderall 20mg BID
Gabapentin (averaging 8/day (2400mg))
xanax been averaging 2mg/daylast three nights i've been wired at night so ive started drinking. now i really feel like crap so thats why i'm starting the perphenazine for anxiety/aggitation.
b2c
Posted by Phillipa on March 14, 2013, at 12:19:56
In reply to anxiety med options, posted by B2chica on March 14, 2013, at 12:15:05
Almost all say drinking isn't good with meds. But when drank beer at night 4 I took low dose of xanax and felt great. So I know you tend at times to overdo so I wouldn't suggest drinking. You know zyprexa works but don't want to take it. What's your doc suggest? Phillipa
Posted by polarbear206 on March 14, 2013, at 21:37:13
In reply to anxiety med options, posted by B2chica on March 14, 2013, at 12:15:05
> i'm going to have to restart perphenazine this weekend. my anxiety is so bad i've been nauseous all week, i'm doing some weird shoulder/neck movement obsessively that is now giving me muscle cramps-aches, and some weird sniffing/snorting tick that i cant take anymore.
> its making me want to just lay in my closet...
>
> thing is perphenazine works great for a couple months, then seems to bring some depression on.
>Gabapentin is a weak mood stabilizer. you really need to take a serious look at
> are there any other solutions out there. and PLEASE dont ask me for zyprexa, im still carrying 30lbs of the weight i gained over the winter from that.
>
> also, every SSRI i've been on i've had manic issues with, so most likely that is not an option.
>
> i take benzo's and they make me...heavy. i dont mind taking them a couple times a week but to do daily i know would start up my depression and feeling like there's cement in my head.
>
> i'm also open to (cheap)herbal supplements.
>
> currently on:
> Pristiq 100mg
> adderall 20mg BID
> Gabapentin (averaging 8/day (2400mg))
> xanax been averaging 2mg/day
>
> last three nights i've been wired at night so ive started drinking. now i really feel like crap so thats why i'm starting the perphenazine for anxiety/aggitation.
>
> b2cGabapentin is a weak mood stabilzer. You and your doctor need to re-eval your drug regime. Stimulants exacerbate anxiety. I would ditch them. Depakote would be a good choice and will zap the anxiety quickly.
Posted by bleauberry on March 15, 2013, at 17:11:01
In reply to anxiety med options, posted by B2chica on March 14, 2013, at 12:15:05
Sorry you are feeling all that stuff!
I was looking at your symptoms and it just seemed to me, everything is all messed, twisted, bizarre...but that tells me stuff.
Best place to start, I believe, is not trying to extinguish the symptoms, because that will never happen as long as the underlying bizarreness whatever it is keeps going. We can improve the symptoms though, and should. But we have to attack the bizarre out of balance stuff, even though we don't know what it is.
We americans like to explain things in science. No matter, stuff works whether we can explain it or not. In your case, it seems to me there is just a lot of stuff out of balance for some reason, things are confused, and you are feeling it in all those symptoms and med reactions and stuff. So the first thing we have to do is do stuff that will help the body balance multiple things, sort of like a shotgun approach, and strengthen it against stresses both mental and physical. The one most herbalists choose for that is Eleuthero. Two others include Rhodiola, and Ashwaganda. Eleuthero didn't agree with me very much, kind of had me feeling not any bettet but likely worse.....rhodiola has been a respectable aid for months....and recent addition of ashwaganda really helps. All so smooth and transparent though, can't feel a thing other than better. They take a while....weeks and months, as all the mess gets untangled.
They are all cheap.
Obviously it's more scientific than that how these particular plants work in the human body at various receptor sites, and there are hundreds of scientific studies on them, but the main thing is....they work....and have for a couple thousand years, on a wide variety of symptom complexes and diseases, with focus on energy, mood, balance, and sleep.
I suggested those not just from lots of personal experience and research on them, but because they are the ones with the types of mechanisms needed to possibly stop the chaos going on in side. After a few weeks at the right dose, common outcomes include better sleep, better energy, better mood, absence of anxiety....regardless of the cause. A quality I would give them, though I have never heard of anyone else referring to them in this way, is they are very good mood stabilizers. It puzzles me why they are not known in the bipolar world.
They are non toxic and safe to take with meds. There have been very rare incidents of serotonin syndrome reported when rhodiola was added to ssri, but it deserves mention for awareness sake....that only proves it does stuff in the brain in similar fashion as the meds. There is a psychiatrist in new york who prescribes rhodiola with or without meds, and it was the thing that saved his wife from a bout of lyme and depression when meds didn't quite do it.
I think the potency of meds is too high for a single herb to compete with, so if one of the meds is causing your problems, that's a different story.
And while anything is possible, with your symptoms, history, and ongoing difficulties, I don't think a sole focus on the psychiatry toolbox is giving a lot of confidence at this time. Time to try stuff that goes deeper than those and does more than those.
Dosing with any of the herbal medicines I mentioned can be tricky in the first couple weeks, but often goes smooth without a hitch. I had to titrate slowly.
I have used caps and tabs for years, and got good at making custom doses of any size, but this year I have found that I like the tincture versions of herbs much better. They seem, to me anyway, to feel like they work better, maybe they are absorbed better, dunno, but custom dosing is super easy.
Posted by tensor on March 16, 2013, at 15:09:02
In reply to anxiety med options, posted by B2chica on March 14, 2013, at 12:15:05
> i'm going to have to restart perphenazine this weekend. my anxiety is so bad i've been nauseous all week, i'm doing some weird shoulder/neck movement obsessively that is now giving me muscle cramps-aches, and some weird sniffing/snorting tick that i cant take anymore.
> its making me want to just lay in my closet...
>
> thing is perphenazine works great for a couple months, then seems to bring some depression on.
>
> are there any other solutions out there. and PLEASE dont ask me for zyprexa, im still carrying 30lbs of the weight i gained over the winter from that.
>
> also, every SSRI i've been on i've had manic issues with, so most likely that is not an option.
>
> i take benzo's and they make me...heavy. i dont mind taking them a couple times a week but to do daily i know would start up my depression and feeling like there's cement in my head.
>
> i'm also open to (cheap)herbal supplements.
>
> currently on:
> Pristiq 100mg
> adderall 20mg BID
> Gabapentin (averaging 8/day (2400mg))
> xanax been averaging 2mg/day
>
> last three nights i've been wired at night so ive started drinking. now i really feel like crap so thats why i'm starting the perphenazine for anxiety/aggitation.
>
> b2cGeodon or Risperdal. Clomipramine, if you can take the side effects.
/tensor
Posted by b2chica on March 18, 2013, at 11:56:09
In reply to Re: anxiety med options » B2chica, posted by tensor on March 16, 2013, at 15:09:02
Geodon and Risperdal are out. tried them before.
clomipramine, might be an option, i was actually considering desipramine at one time. Thing is i'm on Pristiq right now that is working fairly well for depression.
would i have to go off that to start clomipramine?thanks
b2c.> Geodon or Risperdal. Clomipramine, if you can take the side effects.
>
> /tensor
Posted by b2chica on March 18, 2013, at 11:59:24
In reply to Re: anxiety med options, posted by bleauberry on March 15, 2013, at 17:11:01
Basically i need to get a real control on my anxiety. it starts out mild but without intervention that sticks it gets worse (and my life environment hasn't been helping in this department lately).
but gaba is wearing out, and started augmenting with xanax and started to get some depression (it does that after a while) plus feeling a bit like cement in the head.anyway!
thanks for the suggestions. I have heard of Rhodiola before but not Ashwaganda and Eleuthero1. are these things you take once a day or more?
2. what dose do you start with?
3. what kind of store can you buy them at?Thanks for suggestions.
Posted by tensor on March 18, 2013, at 12:19:32
In reply to Re: anxiety med options » tensor, posted by b2chica on March 18, 2013, at 11:56:09
> Geodon and Risperdal are out. tried them before.
>
> clomipramine, might be an option, i was actually considering desipramine at one time. Thing is i'm on Pristiq right now that is working fairly well for depression.
> would i have to go off that to start clomipramine?
>
> thanks
> b2c.They could be taken together but would probably be unnecessary. Pristiq's mechanisms of actions are covered by clomipramine. Both works on serotonin so it could be too much.
/tensor
Posted by ChicagoKat on March 18, 2013, at 19:38:35
In reply to Re: anxiety med options » b2chica, posted by tensor on March 18, 2013, at 12:19:32
One thing no one has mentioned: Pristiq can contribute to anxiety. I can't tolerate it myself because it makes me want to crawl out of my skin.
And the poster who said that your stim contributes to anxiety was spot on. If you suffer from uncontrolled anxiety stims are seriously out.
I used to take Ritalin, it really helped my depression, but then my anxiety got out of control so it has been stopped. I tried to take even a *crumb* of it last week and ended up with the worst anxiety I've ever had in my life.
I wish you the best of luck,
Kat
Posted by b2 chica on March 20, 2013, at 12:29:40
In reply to Re: anxiety med options, posted by ChicagoKat on March 18, 2013, at 19:38:35
early on i was on pristiq with no stim and i dropped bad (mood). so had to start up adderall again. it seems over the years my stim is the one thing that keeps me alive and trying.
and i was doing ok from about december till now. i think environmental things just got too much for me too.
i would rather give up pristiq before i'd give up my adderall.
and pristiq gives me a little anxiety about an hour after i take it but then goes away after another hour. thats why i know its more than that or adderall, cuz i have it even if i dont take adderall. and it lasts all day. first thing in the morning.anyway.
i've started my perphenazine, its helped about 90%, but my mood is now slightly down. i thought i'd at least have a few months before that started... :(
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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