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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 79 to 103 of 103. Go back in thread:
Posted by Ron Hill on November 25, 2007, at 1:18:24
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » Ron Hill, posted by clipper40 on November 24, 2007, at 4:37:12
> I think the script is the best way to go too. (I'm just not sure how much longer I'll be able to afford health insurance.)
C40,Pull up the Deplin home page:
In the header, in the far right column, click "Get a ValueCard", and print the ValueCard.
From the home page click "Price Quote". Print the quote to show your pharmacy.
Use the "Pharmacy Availability" link to see if your pharmacy, or another nearby pharmacy, accepts the coupon.
Clipper, will you do me a favor? If you have time, will you tell me your dx, list your current meds and dosages, list the meds you have tried in the past, and briefly tell me your reaction to your previous med trials. Finally, list the symptoms of your disorder(s) that remain problematic.
I saw in another thread that you are considering an AP, but wisely you're concerned about the possible side effects.
On this end, 34 days ago I modified my med combo by adding 15 mg/day of Deplin, along with 50 mg/day of the VERY IMPORTANT Pyridoxal-5'-Phosphate (P-5-P), and 2000 mcg/day of the VERY IMPORTANT methylcobalamin (methyl-B12).
P-5-P is the coenzyme form of B-6, ready for direct use in metabolic cycles. And, methyl-B12 is the form of B12 used directly in the brain.
As I've stated before, it is very important to take P-5-P and methyl-B12 with Deplin. The P-5-P dosage should not exceed 200 mg/day. Other than that, I'd say the pt should play with the dosages until the dosages feels right.
With only 34 days of use, it's too early to do the victory dance. However, I'm getting such excellent results that I have went ahead and put on my dancing shoes in anticipation of continued remission of my bipolar II ultra rapid cycling depression and dysphoria.
For me, the positive effects of the Deplin/P-5-P/methyl-B12 addition began the second day. My wife tells me that Deplin has changed me from "Growly Boy" to "Lovey-Dovey Boy"
Thanks for allowing me to repeat some of what I have mentioned in the past. I'm just hoping to get the word out.
Thanks, C40. Hope to hear back from you.
-- Ron
Currently in near-full remission.
dx: Bipolar II, with ultra rapid cycling (15 days for one complete cycle), and mild Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder (OCPD)600 mg/day Trileptal
200 mg/day Lamictal
875 mg/day Keppra
90 mg/day Nardil
15 mg/day Deplin
P-5-P
Methyl-B12Androgel: 4 pumps of Androgel testosterone on a prn basis (typically administered once) during the two or three days of ultra rapid cycling depressive phases which occur every 15 days.
A few miscellaneous other vitamins and supplements: zinc, phosphatidylserine, selenium, vitamin D, Mg Malate/dietary Ca in yogurt etc, liquid fish oil, a good daily multiple vitamin.
Posted by clipper40 on November 25, 2007, at 17:43:05
In reply to Deplin Cost Reduction Coupon » clipper40, posted by Ron Hill on November 25, 2007, at 1:18:24
Ron,
Thanks so much for caring! I'll send you a babblemail soon.
Clipper
Posted by Ron Hill on December 4, 2007, at 18:59:38
In reply to Deplin Has Made rHill Well (So Far, As of Day 26 ) » Fivefires, posted by Ron Hill on November 16, 2007, at 1:08:35
To All PB Participants Interested in Deplin,
After 39 days of use, Deplin has quit providing any antidepressant effect and it has turned against me.
I am currently in a difficult depression that I can't pull out of.
Prior to starting Deplin, my BP II ultra rapid cycling caused me to have 3 days of depression out of every 15 days. This reoccurred over and over like clockwork. I could depend on it, and I would know when the depression would abate.
However, my current depression is lasting longer than three days, and there is no sign of relief in sight. I have no idea how long the depression will last.
I am titrating down my Deplin dosage.
Deplin provided good benefits and showed great promise during the first month or so. But, now it has turned against me and it has left me in a heap unable to function.
I will try, but forgive me if I am unable to reply to posts.
-- Ron
Posted by Phillipa on December 4, 2007, at 19:38:08
In reply to My Deplin Trial Failed » All Interested in Deplin, posted by Ron Hill on December 4, 2007, at 18:59:38
Ron oh no I'm so terribly sorry. Will you stay on the other meds or add something? I feel so bad for you. Love Jan
Posted by elanor roosevelt on December 4, 2007, at 22:21:03
In reply to My Deplin Trial Failed » All Interested in Deplin, posted by Ron Hill on December 4, 2007, at 18:59:38
I am so sorry to hear this.
I know that when meds turn on you it can be ugly.
Have you called your doctor?
It's easy to get stuck where you are in your head after a crash so please take care
To All PB Participants Interested in Deplin,
>
> After 39 days of use, Deplin has quit providing any antidepressant effect and it has turned against me.
>
> I am currently in a difficult depression that I can't pull out of.
>
> Prior to starting Deplin, my BP II ultra rapid cycling caused me to have 3 days of depression out of every 15 days. This reoccurred over and over like clockwork. I could depend on it, and I would know when the depression would abate.
>
> However, my current depression is lasting longer than three days, and there is no sign of relief in sight. I have no idea how long the depression will last.
>
> I am titrating down my Deplin dosage.
>
> Deplin provided good benefits and showed great promise during the first month or so. But, now it has turned against me and it has left me in a heap unable to function.
>
> I will try, but forgive me if I am unable to reply to posts.
>
> -- Ron
Posted by clipper40 on December 5, 2007, at 0:40:02
In reply to My Deplin Trial Failed » All Interested in Deplin, posted by Ron Hill on December 4, 2007, at 18:59:38
Oh Ron, I'm so very sad to read about your current difficulty. It has to be terribly disappointing for you when you had such high hopes for Deplin. Is there any chance that a lower dosage might be the answer?
You will pull out of this bad cycle. You always have.
I wish I could do more than just commiserate with you. You are such a special person and so many of us here care about you and are rooting for you.
Clipper
Posted by stargazer2 on December 5, 2007, at 8:14:02
In reply to My Deplin Trial Failed » All Interested in Deplin, posted by Ron Hill on December 4, 2007, at 18:59:38
Ron, i wouldn' think that could happen with Deplin, as it is considered a medical food product of sorts. Is there a side effect listing for it? Is deplin the only thing that changed since you started it?
I hope you can get back on course soon. do you have a plan as to what to do next?
Stargazer
Posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 13:21:51
In reply to Re: My Deplin Trial Failed » Ron Hill, posted by clipper40 on December 5, 2007, at 0:40:02
Jan, Elanor R, C40, Star,
and All PB interested in Deplin;Hey, good news. During my week long depression, I thought my problem was Deplin. But, I kept taking my usual 15 mg/day. Duh!
Yesterday (12/05/07), for the first time, I cut my Deplin dosage down to 1/4 of a 7.5mg tablet (= 1.875 mg). This morning my depression is gone. I will not know for sure until the end of the day, but it would appear that my depressive episode is over.
I do not plan to throw the Deplin baby out with the wash. Instead, these results indicate to me that I was taking too much and I need to hunt around via trial-and-error to find my optimal dosage which remains sustainable over the long-term.
Was remission due to placebo? No way. I did not even remotely think that the one day reduction in Deplin dosage would terminate my depression.
Was the timing of my Deplin dose reduction and the time when I came out of depression merely coincidence? Nope. Whenever I'm about to cycle out of depression, I always start to feel some relief the evening before. However, yesterday I was depressed all day and all evening right up to bedtime.
So yippy, skippy; I'm good to go. I feel great; motivation and energy are good, mood is good, outlook on life is good, and etc. Now, I can get back to working on my projects just in the nick of time. Winter is coming and I do not have my outside work done for the year. Time to get hoppin'.
My wish is for all in PB-land to find wellness, and yet I know how difficult the path can be for those who cannot find relief. My heart goes out to each of you who find yourself in the unrelenting pain yet again today. We're all pulling for you, and cheering as you continue the fight to find wellness and simultaneously endure today's pain.
Jan, Elanor, Clipper, and Star; a special thanks to each of you. In the mist of my depression, your words brought a smile to my face, a warm feeling in my heart, and moisture to my eyes. Thanks for being there!
For all interested in Deplin, please look at this study (hopefully you can pull these links up without a password):
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/84/1/156#F1
In particular, all I want us to look at is Figure 1 and Figure 2 from the above study:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content-nw/full/84/1/156/F1
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content-nw/full/84/1/156/F2
It is not the point of this article, nor the point of these graphs. However, I observe that, for a constant dosage (0.416 mg/day) of [6S]-5-methyltetrahydrofolate, which is another name for L-methylfolate (i.e.; Deplin), the red blood cell folate concentration (Fig 1) and the plasma folate concentration (Fig 2) continue to increase over the 24 week period shown.
Put more simply, as I continue to take the same daily dosage of Deplin, the folate concentrations continually raise in my red blood cells and in my plasma.
So even though I kept my Deplin dosage constant, internal folate levels continued to increase over time. Could this be part of the reason I became depressed while continuing to take the same daily dosage (15 mg/day) that worked so well for me in the beginning of my Deplin trial?
And further, does this mean that all of us on Deplin should consider reducing our daily dosages as our time (i.e.; weeks) on the Deplin progresses? The one fly in the ointment in all this is that the graphs are not showing actually brain cell levels of folate. However, as I understand it, red blood cell folate concentrations are fairly well correlated with brain level concentrations.
What da-ya-think? Are my observations of the graphed data all wet?
As a final note, I do not, nor have I ever, anticipated Deplin would stop my rapid cycling. There are no research data to support it. Instead, my hope has always been that it would reduce the severity and perhaps the duration of my ultra rapid cycle depressive phases.
-- Ron
dx: Bipolar II, with ultra rapid cycling (15 days for one complete cycle), and mild Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder (OCPD)
600 mg/day Trileptal
200 mg/day Lamictal
875 mg/day Keppra
90 mg/day Nardil
1.9 mg/day Deplin
Posted by clipper40 on December 6, 2007, at 16:31:23
In reply to I'm Well Again.Thanks » Jan, Elanor, C40, Star, PB, posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 13:21:51
Ron,
I'm so happy for you! It's so nice to read that you're back on track again. Your conclusion makes total sense to me. I can see that you will have a lot of experimenting to do to find the best dosage for you that it is sustainable over the long-run. But I'm sure you will find that ultimate dosage and get the maximum benefit from Deplin.
Good luck with all of your projects and have a wonderful holiday season!
Clipper
Posted by Phillipa on December 6, 2007, at 19:39:56
In reply to Re: I'm Well Again.Thanks » Ron Hill, posted by clipper40 on December 6, 2007, at 16:31:23
Ron yeah!!!!!! I've been thinking a lot about you and how that could happen private conversations too. Just happy you're better. Love Jan
Posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 21:56:27
In reply to Re: I'm Well Again.Thanks » Ron Hill, posted by clipper40 on December 6, 2007, at 16:31:23
Clipper,
I have not forgot about finishing my reply to your B-mail regarding your dx, related brain chemisty issues, and possible tx's to consider.
I'll get my reply to you as soon as time allows. I hope to reply sooner rather than later.
-- Ron
Posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 21:58:32
In reply to Re: I'm Well Again.Thanks, posted by Phillipa on December 6, 2007, at 19:39:56
Posted by Phillipa on December 7, 2007, at 0:32:53
In reply to Thank You for Keeping Me in Your Thoughts (nm) » Phillipa, posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 21:58:32
Ron you're a sweetie and have given me hope. Phillipa
Posted by clipper40 on December 7, 2007, at 2:35:05
In reply to Brain Chemistry Issues » clipper40, posted by Ron Hill on December 6, 2007, at 21:56:27
Posted by violetwrites on July 2, 2009, at 0:14:50
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » Ron Hill, posted by clipper40 on November 24, 2007, at 4:37:12
it doesn't matter if you have a script - actually you have to have a script to get deplin - the insurance companies refuse to pay for it.
Mr Obama you promised me my reparations or am I just a naive fool!
Posted by sparkle on July 2, 2009, at 11:52:48
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by violetwrites on July 2, 2009, at 0:14:50
anyone still taking deplin and noticing any benefits?
Posted by Ron Hill on July 4, 2009, at 8:39:10
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by violetwrites on July 2, 2009, at 0:14:50
> it doesn't matter if you have a script - actually you have to have a script to get deplin - the insurance companies refuse to pay for it.
> Mr Obama you promised me my reparations or am I just a naive fool!
-----------------------My insurance company pays for Deplin.
Posted by Macwanted on August 12, 2009, at 2:40:28
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » violetwrites, posted by Ron Hill on July 4, 2009, at 8:39:10
I have a question since I observe some side effects. I am using a combination of Metafolin (200 mcg), Methylcobalamin ( 200 mcg), P-5-P (15 mg) and I observed strong heart beat and mood swing. Does it mean that I am sensitive to one of them and that the mood swing is due to adjustment of neurotransmiters in the brain?
Posted by Ron Hill on August 12, 2009, at 10:49:34
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by Macwanted on August 12, 2009, at 2:40:28
> I have a question since I observe some side effects. I am using a combination of Metafolin (200 mcg), Methylcobalamin ( 200 mcg), P-5-P (15 mg) and I observed strong heart beat and mood swing. Does it mean that I am sensitive to one of them and that the mood swing is due to adjustment of neurotransmiters in the brain?
------------------------------
Mac,
Interesting side effects. I've never heard of this response.
What is your dx? What other meds are you taking?
-- Ron
dx: Bipolar II and mild OCPD
600 mg/day Trileptal
200 mg/day Lamictal
500 mg/day Keppra
90 mg/day Nardil
Posted by jrbecker76 on August 17, 2009, at 16:47:07
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » Macwanted, posted by Ron Hill on August 12, 2009, at 10:49:34
> > I have a question since I observe some side effects. I am using a combination of Metafolin (200 mcg), Methylcobalamin ( 200 mcg), P-5-P (15 mg) and I observed strong heart beat and mood swing. Does it mean that I am sensitive to one of them and that the mood swing is due to adjustment of neurotransmiters in the brain?
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Mac,
>
> Interesting side effects. I've never heard of this response.
>
> What is your dx? What other meds are you taking?
>
> -- Ron
>
> dx: Bipolar II and mild OCPD
>
> 600 mg/day Trileptal
> 200 mg/day Lamictal
> 500 mg/day Keppra
> 90 mg/day Nardil
>
>
>Folic acid and Deplin both made me excitable and anxious, bordering on dysphoric.
Posted by SLS on August 17, 2009, at 17:46:05
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by jrbecker76 on August 17, 2009, at 16:47:07
P-5-P by itself sent me into a paroxysmal suicidal depression within an hour of taking it. Thankfully, it only lasted half the day.
Amazing.
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on August 17, 2009, at 21:28:52
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by SLS on August 17, 2009, at 17:46:05
10mg did nothing positive or negative for me except the third day feeling a bit better but of course could just have been a good day. Why don't meds affect me like others? Phillipa
Posted by Ron Hill on August 18, 2009, at 10:52:03
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » Macwanted, posted by Ron Hill on August 12, 2009, at 10:49:34
> > I have a question since I observe some side effects. I am using a combination of Metafolin (200 mcg), Methylcobalamin ( 200 mcg), P-5-P (15 mg) and I observed strong heart beat and mood swing. Does it mean that I am sensitive to one of them and that the mood swing is due to adjustment of neurotransmiters in the brain?
> Mac,
> Interesting side effects. I've never heard of this response.
> What is your dx? What other meds are you taking?
> -- Ron
> dx: Bipolar II and mild OCPD
> 600 mg/day Trileptal
> 200 mg/day Lamictal
> 500 mg/day Keppra
> 90 mg/day Nardil
Mac,I had forgot about Scott's adverse reaction to P-5-P. My bad.
-- Ron
Posted by SLS on August 18, 2009, at 12:28:54
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate » Macwanted, posted by Ron Hill on August 18, 2009, at 10:52:03
> Mac,
>
> I had forgot about Scott's adverse reaction to P-5-P. My bad.I wouldn't go by me. My case is very idiosyncratic.
There is nothing bad about you.
- Scott
Posted by Ron Hill on August 18, 2009, at 16:52:53
In reply to Re: Folinic Acid vs L-methylfolate, posted by SLS on August 18, 2009, at 12:28:54
> There is nothing bad about you.
Oh if you only knew.
(-;
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]
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