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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
If you knew that someone was planning to end their life, what would you say to them? Do you think it would make a difference?
Posted by chumbawumba on May 24, 2009, at 16:48:40
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
I'd try to convince them to check into the hospital if they were really serious.
Also, I might point out to them that it is impossible for them to know for certain that death is really the end of their problems.
Posted by Phillipa on May 24, 2009, at 19:31:53
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by chumbawumba on May 24, 2009, at 16:48:40
Agree with above and that death is forever. Phillipa
Posted by Neal on May 24, 2009, at 19:37:08
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
Does the person already have "a plan" of how they are going to do it? Or are they "having thoughts about it from time to time"? The first is orders of magnitude worse than the second - get help immediately.
The latter is still a signal - it usually means depression if it's been going on for some time. They need all the support, love, and professional help you can give or arrange.
This is just an rough guide. Who can really know what's in a person's mind? The person needs help. There's usually no magic statement that solves it. Competent professional help and loving support are the best weapons.
Posted by SLS on May 24, 2009, at 20:05:22
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
> If you knew that someone was planning to end their life, what would you say to them?
I don't know. It depends on the details.
Are you having thoughts of suicide yourself, Maxime?
I might first tell them that autoeuthanasia is certainly their right to act on, but that I don't think it is time yet to go through with it. There are alternatives. I would stress that these suicidal episodes almost always pass, and that they already know this from experience. Things that seem overwhelming today, might not seem so a week from now. I might recommend that they first enter a hospitalization program to promote safety and help work through the crisis.
> Do you think it would make a difference?
For some people, perhaps not.
I think a sympathetic ear can go a long way. I also think it is important to convey how important they are to the people around them, and that they really do matter.
It is so hard to know what to say. Each person is unique and has a unique set of challenges. Each has a unique psychodynamic. I think it helps more to ask questions than to dictate answers.
- Scott
Posted by Sigismund on May 24, 2009, at 21:20:49
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
>If you knew that someone was planning to end their life, what would you say to them?
Maxi, you would know better than I would what to say.
I might say something along the lines of that we are thrown into this life, we don't have to like it to say nothing of being happy, but that handling it the best way we can is our task here.>Do you think it would make a difference?
It's not impossible that it might, though I wouldn't expect it.
I think that suicide is a reasonable and justifiable option, though clearly not an optimal one.
Posted by floatingbridge on May 24, 2009, at 22:33:09
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by SLS on May 24, 2009, at 20:05:22
Scott, I like your answer, especially when you say the impulse passes. I think, most times it really does, and the person needs to be reminded.
Posted by Neal on May 25, 2009, at 2:23:06
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
_
> If you knew that someone was planning to end their life, what would you say to them? Do you think it would make a difference?
There's 4 or 5 different takes on your questions, Maxime. Did they help at all? Did they miss the point? Is it you that you're talking about. It's okay to talk about it.
One thing I think mentioned was how devastated the survivors will be; it can really make a suicidal person take pause, if they really think about it. Another is that whether you believe in God or not, life is sacred, and so is each person.
Let us know what you think . . .
_
Posted by SLS on May 25, 2009, at 8:37:44
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » Maxime, posted by Neal on May 25, 2009, at 2:23:06
> One thing I think mentioned was how devastated the survivors will be; it can really make a suicidal person take pause, if they really think about it.
I never thought it should make a difference to take into consideration how my loss would affect others. I am more selfish than that. My resting in peace takes precedent over others' living in peace. Now, I realize that several times, I chose not to commit suicide until after my grandmother died. So, here, I really was taking into consideration how another would be affected by my loss. After reading many accounts of suicidal thinking on Psycho-Babble, I have taken note of just how many people are saved by such thinking. It really can make the difference between life and death.
> Another is that whether you believe in God or not, life is sacred, and so is each person.
My personal spirituality has been another life-saver for me. I do believe in God. For me, it doesn't make sense not to. I do find that life is a gift. It is a brilliant exercise of God's handywork. Still, I don't think He would find fault with someone taking their own life. Again, this is a part of my persoal spiritual belief system.
Religious affiliation and the attendance of formal services has been demonstrated to be associated with a reduced rate of suicide according to research studies. It has a greater impact than does spirituality per se.
- Scott
Posted by Racer on May 25, 2009, at 18:40:11
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
Hey, Babe --
It depends a lot for me. For many people, I would probably just offer my ear, and possibly ask if they've considered alternatives.
For some special people, I think I would go farther -- I'd include some information about what has kept me from choosing that option, and a few reminders of other times they've felt this way. I'd also include a reminder about how they've felt when they found a drug cocktail that helped, when the therapy helped, and so on.
And, in some cases, I'd also try to be more communicative via email. That's only for very special people, though...
Posted by Phillipa on May 25, 2009, at 20:47:02
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » Neal, posted by SLS on May 25, 2009, at 8:37:44
Scott sounds like my pdoc in the hospital now says it's my right. Phillipa
Posted by Neal on May 25, 2009, at 23:21:22
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » Neal, posted by SLS on May 25, 2009, at 8:37:44
> My personal spirituality has been another life-saver for me. I do believe in God. For me, it doesn't make sense not to. I do find that life is a gift. It is a brilliant exercise of God's handywork. Still, I don't think He would find fault with someone taking their own life. Again, this is a part of my persoal spiritual belief system.
>
> Religious affiliation and the attendance of formal services has been demonstrated to be associated with a reduced rate of suicide according to research studies. It has a greater impact than does spirituality per se.
>Good point. I think that the only real differences people have are in their concept of God.
And Life is an amazing adventure if you think about it; I don't want to miss a minute, no matter what has happened or will happen.
_
Posted by SLS on May 26, 2009, at 0:12:19
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Neal on May 25, 2009, at 23:21:22
Neal, you make me smile.
> And Life is an amazing adventure if you think about it; I don't want to miss a minute, no matter what has happened or will happen.I feel the same way.
- Scott
Posted by manic666 on May 26, 2009, at 13:06:00
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » Neal, posted by SLS on May 26, 2009, at 0:12:19
as the doc said to me , manic kill yourself an you kill your kids as well
Posted by B2chica on May 27, 2009, at 12:31:15
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
well, i'll approach this from the other side.
when i have been in those situations i basically had lost ALL hope. Everything was useless, no point, and i wasn't worth helping.
so my best advice would be, try you best to offer them hope. that there IS that one person (doctor, therapist, nurse) that can help you and is WAITING to try. ask them to give that person a chance.
to try a T, to try a pdoc, or family physician, and most importantly to give the hospital a try.
if they've done hospital before, tell them "what is it going to hurt to try once more" you can always act later, just give this alternative/person a try.offer them hope that there ARE medications, treatments that they have not yet tried, and THAT one may be the working one.
********
definately push the outside help. cuz as much as family and friends want to help, it's not always the best. Sometimes we need the stranger telling us that my life is worth while, and maybe that one stranger is the person i can tell a problem to that i couldn't tell family or friends.best luck M
b2c.
Posted by Neal on May 28, 2009, at 19:06:00
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
_
Does anybody remember The Electric Light Orchestra's "Livin Thing". The refrain goes:It's a livin thing
It's a terrible thing to lose
It's a givin thing
It's a terrible thing to lose
__________________________________Omar Kayam's immortal lines from the Rubaiyat, which is recommended reading for a depressed person. He really puts things in perspective. This sample from the Edward FitzGerald translation of I889 (still the best).
Here with a Loaf of Bread beneath the Bough,
A Flask of Wine, a Book of Verse -- and Thou
Beside me singing in the Wilderness --
And Wilderness is Paradise now._
Posted by SLS on May 28, 2009, at 22:59:46
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
> If you knew that someone was planning to end their life, what would you say to them? Do you think it would make a difference?
What's happening?
- Scott
Posted by DG77 on May 29, 2009, at 16:02:08
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Neal on May 28, 2009, at 19:06:00
These are the lyrics to a beautiful song on the subject. The song is Poughkeepsie by a band called Over The Rhine.
I thought Id go up Poughkeepsie,
look out oer the Hudson,
and Id throw my body down on the river.
And Id know no more sorrow,
Id fly like the sparrow
and Id ride on the backs of the angels tonight.Id ride on the backs of the angels tonight.
Id take to the sky with all my might.
No more drowning in my sorrow,
no more drowning in my fright,
Id just ride on the backs of the angels tonight.There are those who know sorrow
and those who must borrow
and those whose lot in life is sweet.
Well Im drunk on self-pity,
scorned all thats been given me,
I would drink from a bottle labeled Sure Defeat.Id ride on the backs of the angels tonight.
Id take to the sky with all my might.
No more drowning in my sorrow,
no more drowning in my fright,
Id just ride on the backs of the angels tonight.Then the skies, they fell open
and my eyes were opened
to a world of hope falling at my feet.
Now Ive no more or less
than anyone else has,
what I have is a gift of life I cant repeat.So I go up Poughkeepsie,
look out oer the Hudson
and I cast my worries to the sky.
Now I still know sorrow,
but I can fly like the sparrow
cause I ride on the backs of the angels tonight.I ride on the backs of the angels tonight.
I take to the sky with all their might.
No more drowning in my sorrow,
no more drowning in my fright,
Ill just ride on the backs of the angels each night.
Posted by Cass on May 29, 2009, at 21:41:32
In reply to What would you tell a suicidal person?, posted by Maxime on May 24, 2009, at 15:53:50
I'd tell them about my own experience, tell them I was in the hospital and am feeling better. Then I'd drive them to the hospital if they would let me or I would call 911. I would just pray they had good insurance. I've heard terrible things about county hospitals.
Posted by Neal on May 30, 2009, at 0:49:48
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » Neal, posted by DG77 on May 29, 2009, at 16:02:08
_
Listen to the Mustn'ts,child,
Listen to the Don'ts
Listen to the Shouldn'ts
The Impossibles, the Won'ts
Listen to the Never Haves,
Then listen close to me --
Anything can happen, child,
Anything can be._______________________________
CHICAGO
They tell me you are wicked and I believe them, for I
have seen your painted women under the gas lamps
luring the farm boys.
And they tell me you are crooked and I answer: Yes, it
is true, I have seen the gunman kill and go free to
kill again.
And they tell me you are brutal and my reply is: On the
faces of women and children I have seen the marks
of wanton hunger.
And having answered so I turn once more to those who
sneer at this my city, and I give them back the sneer
and say to them:
Come and show me another city with lifted head singing
so proud to be alive and coarse and strong and cunning.
Flinging magnetic curses amid the toil of piling job on
job, here is a tall bold slugger set vivid against the
little soft cities;Fierce as a dog with tongue lapping for action, cunning
as a savage pitted against the wilderness,
Bareheaded,
Shoveling,
Wrecking,
Planning,
Building, breaking, rebuilding,
Under the smoke, dust all over his mouth, laughing with
white teeth,
Under the terrible burden of destiny laughing as a young
man laughs,
Laughing even as an ignorant fighter laughs who has
never lost a battle,
Bragging and laughing that under his wrist is the pulse.
and under his ribs the heart of the people,
Laughing!
Laughing the stormy, husky, brawling laughter of
Youth, half-naked, sweating, proud to be Hog
Butcher, Tool Maker, Stacker of Wheat, Player with
Railroads and Freight Handler to the Nation.Carl Sandburg
Posted by SLS on May 30, 2009, at 5:39:52
In reply to Re: What would you tell a suicidal person? » DG77, posted by Neal on May 30, 2009, at 0:49:48
Where are you?
Don't make us come out there!
:-)
How can we not conclude that you were asking questions on your own behalf?
What's going on with you? Are you the suicidal one?
- Scott
Posted by B2chica on June 1, 2009, at 11:57:41
In reply to Maxime!, posted by SLS on May 30, 2009, at 5:39:52
Posted by PolarBabe on June 2, 2009, at 11:06:07
In reply to Maxime! please respond (nm), posted by B2chica on June 1, 2009, at 11:57:41
I don't like that there hasn't been a response and it sets my stomach uneasy, but I have one very simple statement that I would say to a suicidal person. I hope there is still time for me to say it.
SUICIDE IS A PERMANENT SOLUTION TO A TEMPORARY PROBLEM.
This statement has helped me hang on many times. I hope it helps the person who needs the hope.
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]
Script revised: February 4, 2008
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