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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by gardenergirl on June 21, 2007, at 7:27:33
In reply to Re: Alrighty then, my mistake. » gardenergirl, posted by Phillipa on June 20, 2007, at 23:14:35
I see now. Glad to help. :)
gg
Posted by linkadge on June 21, 2007, at 7:56:44
In reply to Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :) » Phillipa, posted by gardenergirl on June 21, 2007, at 7:27:33
Tianeptine is not avaiable in the U.S. or Canada. Apparently North America doesn't like people creating more effective meds that contradict their inacurate theories about how medications should work.
They keep tianeptine out so that they can continue to pretend to know it all.
I know..B.S....but perhaps a partial truth.
Linkadge
Posted by BabyBunny on June 21, 2007, at 9:11:06
In reply to Best Ad for Mild to Moderate Depression Least Side, posted by Phillipa on June 20, 2007, at 15:00:05
No No No! I changed my mind! If you have Bipolar DO NOT take Lexapro even at 2.5mg! The others from my post were right. I did a 180 again and feel awful today even though yesterday was great. It DEFINITELY induced the rapid cycling of My Bipolar I.
No more antidepressants for me! That's it! I'm even gonna try to go off my Depakote cuz that makes me depressed. I believe I feel better with less meds.
Posted by Fivefires on June 21, 2007, at 12:01:07
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :), posted by linkadge on June 21, 2007, at 7:56:44
But, how would we get 'a P' to follow us along if we ordered Tianipine? We'd basically be on our own. Doesn't that scare any1? Doesn't really scare me that much, but then tell me to jump, and I'll jump!
Good thread Phillipa. Sorry bunny re: Lex.
5f
Posted by Bob on June 21, 2007, at 13:16:08
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :), posted by Fivefires on June 21, 2007, at 12:01:07
> But, how would we get 'a P' to follow us along if we ordered Tianipine? We'd basically be on our own. Doesn't that scare any1? Doesn't really scare me that much, but then tell me to jump, and I'll jump!
>
> Good thread Phillipa. Sorry bunny re: Lex.
>
> 5f
>
>It scares the hell outta me. If I'm in super bad shape and need more meds but somehow my supply got interrupted, I'd be royally screwed.
Posted by BabyBunny on June 21, 2007, at 15:35:57
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :), posted by Fivefires on June 21, 2007, at 12:01:07
Thanks so much 5F. I greatly appreciate it. I had a total breakdown today. This is only the 3rd time I have been out of my bedroom all day. And I was on the phone with my mom for literally 7 hours since we are far from one another. I was scared to death all day and really broke down BAD. I mean BAD. We just hung up and I'm so exhausted I can barely function.
I do wish you all the best and hope you all get the treatment you deserve and need. I hope this for each of us as suffering with a mental health issue (or numerous) is terrible not only for us but those around us. I will pray for all for healing as we all should have wonderful, happy, full lives.
Take good care everyone and please be strong. Bless you all!
Hugs,
Baby Bunny
> But, how would we get 'a P' to follow us along if we ordered Tianipine? We'd basically be on our own. Doesn't that scare any1? Doesn't really scare me that much, but then tell me to jump, and I'll jump!
>
> Good thread Phillipa. Sorry bunny re: Lex.
>
> 5f
>
>
Posted by Fivefires on June 22, 2007, at 5:25:53
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :) » Fivefires, posted by BabyBunny on June 21, 2007, at 15:35:57
Hugs back to you Baby Bunny!
5f
Posted by Racer on June 22, 2007, at 12:40:34
In reply to A tangent suggestion » Phillipa, posted by gardenergirl on June 20, 2007, at 16:14:03
Posted by Racer on June 22, 2007, at 12:47:26
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :), posted by Fivefires on June 21, 2007, at 12:01:07
> But, how would we get 'a P' to follow us along if we ordered Tianipine? We'd basically be on our own. Doesn't that scare any1?
It really depends on the pdoc. I've talked to mine about Tianepine, and he's amenable to trying it. We'd order it from abroad, he'd write the prescription for it, do some research to help figure out dosage, etc, and he'd do the same follow up that he does now with regularly approved drugs. Although I think my pdoc is certainly exceptional, I don't think he's necessarily unique in this regard. He says he's ordered other drugs from abroad for his patients over the years, as well as sending a number of people abroad for TMS treatment before it was approved here.
So, while it does seem risky to take a medication from overseas without a doctor's supervision, I also think it's worth bringing this sort of thing up with pdocs, to see if they're willing to work with you on it.
By the way, for anyone who has taken Tianepine, did it cause weight gain? And were you susceptible to weight gain on other drugs?
Thanks!
Posted by Quintal on June 22, 2007, at 13:35:55
In reply to Re: Ohh, I misread it. Sorry. :) » Fivefires, posted by Racer on June 22, 2007, at 12:47:26
I didn't notice any significant change in my weight while taking tianeptine, it seems to be fairly weight neutral. I've tended to gain quite a lot of weight on some meds, as much as 56lb accumulated after a few years of antidepressant and benzo use. The longest I've taken tianeptine was three months though.
My first pdoc supervised a trial of tianeptine because he'd never heard of it and was curious. One Irish lady living in New York contacted me through RemedyFind to say her pdoc was doing the same thing, so some pdocs definitely do trials of tianeptine. The idea of taking tianeptine without a pdoc's permission doesn't scare me because it behaves the same way whether a pdoc is watching or not, and I had no problems on my first trial. It's probably one of the most benign pharmaceutical antidepressants in psychiatry.
Q
Posted by maryhelen on June 23, 2007, at 16:20:04
In reply to Tianeptine, posted by Quintal on June 22, 2007, at 13:35:55
Could someone tell me what kind of a medication Taneptine is?
Posted by Fivefires on June 23, 2007, at 17:53:35
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by maryhelen on June 23, 2007, at 16:20:04
Wish I could maryhelen, but I've never tried it; new to me.
Hey Racer, w/ 'my P' working for a county, and I being 'a county patient' v. 'a private patient', I think he'd be unable to write it.
Here's a site w/ lots of info about it.
http://www.tianeptine.com/refs/index.html
Maybe someone else can explain more about tianeptine.
5f
Posted by Racer on June 23, 2007, at 19:03:22
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by maryhelen on June 23, 2007, at 16:20:04
> Could someone tell me what kind of a medication Taneptine is?
Tianepine is a selective serotonin reuptake ENHANCER. It's kinda like the anti-prozac, if you want to look at it that way. It wasn't approved in the US, because the FDA decided it wasn't more effective than the existing ADs, and so we didn't need another anti-depressant... {rolls eyes} I believe it's only available in France at this point, and it's considered to be worth a try for a lot of people who don't respond to the usual suspects.
Hope taht helps.
Posted by Fivefires on June 25, 2007, at 19:47:29
In reply to Re: Tianeptine » maryhelen, posted by Racer on June 23, 2007, at 19:03:22
I'm seeing a different P Weds., so have written this one down to discuss. I understand it is not available in the United States. Is anyone on it? I understand it is indicated for those who have failed to respond to the usual SSRIs.
I'm pretty sure I have TRD (treatment resistant depression). I don't know if I was always this way. I think maybe I did respond to a couple SSRIs and an SNRI in the past. But now, I don't.
I'm following another thread about an atypical antipsychotic, Clozaril (clozapine), indicated for schizophrenia, especially those who have failed to respond to the usual atypical antipsychotics.
It's becoming confusing as both ADs and atypical antipsychotics are being prescribed for ... depression!!!
Wish I could take u w/ me 2 my appt Racer, as I'm less well-educated than u re: the pharmacology of psychiatric medications.
My profession was a med transcr*ptionist. I had to pay more attn to 'not capitalizing generic meds' and 'capitalizing brand name meds', than to the pharmacology of the medications.
I've been glued to my bed far too long, not even logging onto pute.
I'm on nothing but Xanax 2mg t.i.d. (three times a day) and 75mg Lyrica as h.s. (hour of sleep). See, that's the transcr*ptionist in me.
I begin to 'shake fiercely' in 2-3hrs after a Xanax dosage time if I've forgotton to take it.
I tend 'to forget' to take my Xanax, I think, sort of deliberately, because, 'I'm embarrassed to admit I need it' or 'Nervousness has become one of my traits' or 'I'm afraid I'll be called an addict and get one of the usual lectures'.
This is, for me, another confusing cunundrum. Is it addiction or dependence?
I cannot not mention I had a nervous system breakdown which was 'extremely physical' and lacking in any mental dysfunction, but there is 'no code' for this in the coding book in medical records at the hospitals, afa I know. Saying I had a 'nervous breakdown', is taken incorrectly. There are assumptions I stripped naked and ran screaming down the street!(?)
Anyway, I'm feeling I need some help. I'm thinking, 'She needs detox!' just came to some of your minds.(?) I know not all.
I can't seem to get the help I need from 'therapy' or 'family', so will once again turn to a drug.
Yes, I do reach out. If u called the local warm line (non-suicidal line) and said my name, most all peer supports, therapists, or clinicians would recognize it. I'm afraid if I stop talking, I'll stop moving forward, or stop ' trying' to move forward.
A lot of u have known me for more than a couple years. If any1 has any thoughts about what might help me out of my rut, it's cool to say here or by babble feature. I'll even promise not to dodge anti-benzo remarks.
It's clear 2me I'm depressed. Think 'my confusion' is a part of it.
I can't say for sure it is 'clinical' depression or 'incident induced' depression. (I know that's not the proper wording.) I'm a bit of a drama queen and have quite a strong (I don't mean 'strength' strong.) personality as well. I have this sort of 'ignorant courage'. If there's something to be tried, it's likely I'll try it, even at my own risk, w/o knowing all the facts.
I feel the state I'm in may have 'become clinical' over time. Can this happen? I think, after many years, maybe yes.
I've never been psychotic. I have little to 'no symptoms' of bipolarity.
My 'labels' (disdain) are 'depression and anxiety' or 'generalized anxiety disorder' or 'borderline personality disorder'.
I'll check back w/ u all tomorrow, Tuesday. Hope all well.
tks, 5f
Posted by Fivefires on June 26, 2007, at 22:33:18
In reply to Re: Tianeptine (But, not available in US?), posted by Fivefires on June 25, 2007, at 19:47:29
Somewhere here, under tianeptine topic, one made mention of study done in area of anorexia nervosa, showing elevated levels of serotonin in CNS, which might be the cause of the AN.
Then, my take, was an SSR enhancer, might be indicated, alongside the SSRI, to more effectively augment the SSRI.
I'm 5'5 and 120lbs or less, so 'it caught my attn', even though I don't have AN.
I just thought maybe there is some commonality between lightweights like me and elevated levels of serotonin and mayB I need an enhancer alongside an SSRI???
I guess I've been thinking go w/ either:
CELEXA - I might have had some bit of success on it years ago, but ditched it too quickly when a life event pulled me down, an action I've chosen too often out of fear of high dosages.
or
CYMBALTA - Only because used to get results from Effexor-XR and have the c-spine injury. I've never tried Cymbalta. I've been on Eff plain and Eff-XR at least 5x and had various results. Most recent was 'no response .. it didn't work at all'. I believe my body developed a tolerance to it and I would have had to go up to a high dosage to feel anything at all. Then my reg. Pdoc said he hated how awful it was getting me off of it.
Back to SSR enhancers. Mention is made of Sulpiride. Is this available in the US? R there any others?
I've been surviving on Payday candy bars and Pepsi and applesauce. What's up w/ my body wanting all this sugar? Then salt. Oh, that's right, the 4th P, is Pringles. Yeah; I'm totally abusing physical self; can't shake it.
This way of living has snow-balled since moving to an isolated environment, and may have (not sure - so damn confused - got off Valium re: too much sedation) worsened upon switching from Valium to Xanax.
I'm going to this newPdoc in the a.m. and haven't a clue what to focus on. I just know whatever it is, that will take the entire 15 minutes & I'll leave w/ 'one scrip' for 'the first med I mention'.
I want to really discuss my experience w/ all SSRIs causing anxiety, SNRI Effexor and Effexor-XR causing nothing to a little relief to once mania, tricyclics nothing to speak of, mood stabilizers headaches, atypical antipsychotics weight gain; the total of my experiences, all in the constraints of 15 freakin' minutes.
I've lost b4 I've begun.
I've always been on monotherapy. What's w/ this? Lots of u are on cocktails.
All I know is the first med I mention is the one I'll walk out the door with tomorrow.
If I mention Cymbalta, it will be written, and I'll be shown the door.
Maybe I should see if someone could go with me?
Any1 comment?
tks, 5f
ps: I know I ask a lot of u all, which is so ridiculous, as this is the job of a Pdoc. I can't afford private care. I know I'm not getting good care. I tried go thru Medicare advantage plan and found a great Pdoc but couldn't afford the meds he wrote, so had to go back to county.
So, 4 what it's worth, u all are everything to me.
Posted by Phillipa on June 26, 2007, at 23:13:02
In reply to Re: Tianeptine + Fivefires Struggle 2 Get Help, posted by Fivefires on June 26, 2007, at 22:33:18
Well since you can't get tianeptine in the USA focus on what you can have. Cymbalta would be good as it has helped with peripheral neuropathy. It's a very expensive med as it's not in generic. Did you get the med insurance with Medicaire? I did and it pays for all antidepressants 0 money. But not for any benzos. So are you stuck with generics? If so maybe try effexor again? Let me know how the appointment goes. And maybe go from the xanax to valium again. The long half life. Love Phillipa
Posted by linkadge on June 27, 2007, at 7:41:42
In reply to Re: Tianeptine + Fivefires Struggle 2 Get Help, posted by Fivefires on June 26, 2007, at 22:33:18
>Somewhere here, under tianeptine topic, one made >mention of study done in area of anorexia >nervosa, showing elevated levels of serotonin in >CNS, which might be the cause of the AN.
Well, how about that! Force feed the anorexics SSRI's and suddenly one realizes they might have too high circulating serotonin!
I think that they adopt whatever biochemical theory fits the drug.
If the drug lowers chemical x, well then, by God, the disorder must have involved too much of chemical x.
Not to say its not possable, I just think its funny, as for the last 15 years anorexics have had too little serotonin.
Linkadge
Posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 9:27:48
In reply to Re: Tianeptine + Fivefires Struggle 2 Get Help » Fivefires, posted by Phillipa on June 26, 2007, at 23:13:02
If Pdoc cannot write Cymbalta, PCP can.
I had no 'weight gain' on Effexor-XR, in fact, more an opposite I believe, and was stabilizing. But, got to point needed go up to 300mg and I backed off. Getting too high on these frightens me. And yes, I do need to stay w/ one of the anxiolytics. Tks Phillipa!
5f
Posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 9:46:39
In reply to Re: Tianeptine + Fivefires Struggle 2 Get Help, posted by linkadge on June 27, 2007, at 7:41:42
Yes, and all too often life is so this way. Like working from the end back to be the beginning.
So ok ... Can 1 get a lab test for level of serotonin???? And, then is there a baseline?
No wonder SSRIs send me running for a benzo!(?) Had an initial buzz on one, like 'oh ... you found out we were here!' and then a drop and flatline w/ no more buzz.
So, can u explain diff'; enhancing v. inhibiting, how it might play out, link?
tks, 5f
Posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:39:22
In reply to Re: Tianeptine + Fivefires Struggle 2 Get Help, posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 9:46:39
>can u explain diff'; enhancing v. inhibiting, how it might play out, link?
Well, that's what they say tianeptine does (and they would be right) but I wonder if it tells you anything much about the difference between tianeptine and an SSRI (and they wouldn't all be the same....I wouldn't know never having tried one).
People have said this about how tianeptine makes them feel
like an SSRI
much softer and warmer than an SSRI,
mildly prosocial but nothing else
playful
like they are on mushrooms
not quite rightAnd then there are people for whom it has been very useful.
Everyone seems to agree on the benign side effect profile aspect of it.
For me it got me out of the house and up close to the human race, which must count as an achievement.
Posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:41:46
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:39:22
It has made some people anxious, but generally people report feeling less anxious overall.
There's none of this having to wait for 6 weeks either.
You know pretty much within 24 hours if it agrees with you.
At least I did.
Posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 19:36:38
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:39:22
I'm totally envious Linkadge. In a good way!
5f
Posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 19:42:23
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:39:22
Whoops. Yep, I mis-read; I mean Sigimund!
I would adore getting back into 'life' again.
(I hope I'm getting this right, this time. My anxiety is high. I've missed my midday dose of Xanax, again, by about 4 hours!)
loggingoff4abit, 5f
Posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 20:51:39
In reply to Re: Tianeptine, posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 19:42:23
It gave me a 3 month window of opportunity.
Still works, but for 3 months was good enough to get me out in public, and now I've relaxed a little about that.
Posted by Fivefires on June 27, 2007, at 21:57:07
In reply to Re: Tianeptine » Sigismund, posted by Sigismund on June 27, 2007, at 15:41:46
Every SSRI has made me anxious .. hands down.
If this could work differently, it might not. This is what I would really like to find out. How? Not sure. The Pdoc said 'Well first of all, you'd have to go to France to get it!'(?)
Hmmmm. He's not only w/o knowledge of it, he's telling me something that I believe is incorrect. Correct me if wrong, but it is not illegal to buy a med from a different country and use it here if under care of a licensed physician here.
Does any1 think, re: the pharmacology of it being an enhancer, it could be 'less anxiety inducing' than the 'inhibitors'?
Maybe I'd not have to take as much anti-anxiety med as I do now.
5f
ps: Sorry. Think spelled ur user name wrong too, Sigismund. I'm feeling particularly anxious today - lots of life issues going on - and what 'I used to juggle', I'm now lucky to 'throw from one hand to another'.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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