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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by headachequeen on December 5, 2004, at 21:25:36
In reply to No psychs for me thanks!, posted by bridgey1128 on December 5, 2004, at 20:24:07
> Someone asked about talk therapy. Talk therapy as in psychologist, no I have never felt the need. I find them unhelpful and patronizing.
Well, I have to disagree to some extent. If I were to base an opinion on the first psychotherapist (as in psychologist) I met well, I might agree as I found him utterly pathetic and really felt that he was easily manipulated and totally unhelpful. He was convinced that everyone had to fit into a category somewhere, even if that category was unhelpful and inappropriate.
Then I met the second psychiatologist was totally different and unbelievably helpful. He also had little if any use for the first psychologist and his categories and slots and ideas, I might add. His help was sound and he did not insist that I look him in the eye; he realised that there were things we were talking about that made me want to look anywhere but at people, let alone in someone's eyes, and he accepted that.
He was there with a box of tissues when it was needed and with silence when it was needed.
The third and fourth such people I know are also sound practioners of their craft...
If I were to base my opinion of psychiatrists on the first such I met, then I would say that all such are wonderful people with a solid ability to help their patients connect with themselves and their needs and on and on...
but then I met the second one, and he was the head of service and I formed a distinctly negative impression...
and I now think that they are for the most part, note I say, for the MOST part, overpaid and over-rated and I wonder why they are allowed such free rein in treatment...
kat
Posted by redscarlet on December 5, 2004, at 21:53:32
In reply to Re: Heads up » rainy, posted by rainy on December 5, 2004, at 5:47:48
Rainy ~ You may want to try Wellbutrin XL, it's a once a day dosing, it may help.
Posted by rainy on December 6, 2004, at 5:34:17
In reply to Re: Heads up, posted by redscarlet on December 5, 2004, at 21:53:32
Strange to say, it runs out of uummph about midmorning. Sounds even to me like I'm playing the "yes but" game. We've tried all these things in different combininations and only serzone worked.
It worked in a mild but steady way to keep me functioning well, laughing, spontaneously asking friends over for dinner (not since we moved since we don't have any friends--long story about minister having dual relationships) and generally being a "normal" depressed person.
Now, I generally feel OK until I take my meds and then the physical stuff takes over. I truly don't want to keep taking Klonopin just to breathe! It's getting worse and since I'm not a Christian and the kids are gone it isn't the holdays. Traditionally we don't spend much at Christmas so there's not that pressure. Lack of snow and the mild, sunny weather is terribly bothersome though, and adding to my irritability and sadness. I hate the sun.
So, more disciplined with the walks, Mitzvah therapy, attention to diet--full fruits, veggies, vitamins, water, chicken fish whole grains etc. ahead. Continue Topamax, sleep, good books, music, a couple of parties to go to, writing in my journal, this board and maybe Psych Central, finish acupuncture, stop griping so much, check out Planned Parenthood for volunteer opportunities, don't smile if I don't feel like it, and cut down on activities I really dread, can't stop one. I can do everything but the volunteer stuff right now (and maybe the griping) but it's a day at a time process.
I'm thinking of changing pdocs if she won't go with the weaning off plan, at least while I have the insurance. Oh boy. That sounds irresponsible, doesn't it?Thanks for your suggestion, Redscarlet.
rainy
Posted by bridgey1128 on December 6, 2004, at 8:33:21
In reply to Re: Heads up » redscarlet, posted by rainy on December 6, 2004, at 5:34:17
I find smiling very theraputic but I think I understand what you mean though. A fake, forced smile is hard. When you feel crappy those aren't fun. I had never heard of Mitzvah therapy. Well, let me put it this way, I didn't realize that was a kind of professional or non? therapy. That is a very GOOD therapy. As a Christian, I am called to do those kinds of things anyway. Maybe it's a built in kind of therapy. :P I think most people, regardless of our religion, are naturally selfish creatures. And so when we let go and do for other people, without any kind of thought for ourselves or want in something in return, it feels really good. And it should. I guess one of the reasons that I have not felt the need to have talk therapy is because I have always felt so comfortable around my church family. I am not trying to get into a religious discussion by any stretch, but I am saying that when you have a supportive structure, whether it be friends or family or a church or social group, sometimes there is no need for a cold professional. Well, not to say they are all cold. I am sure that many are very supportive and warm. And many people would prefer to talk to someone one on one in an office environment where they feel like their "secrets" will not be exposed and they feel secure or whatever the reason is that they would rather speak to a professional. THere is nothing wrong with that. THere are good ones and bad ones in every field. As for medication, Topomax is the only thing I have ever tried that has ever worked long term. Everything else has either just stopped working, didn't work at all, made me nuts, or had weird off the wall side effects. Even with Topomax I sometimes wonder if it's working. It doesn't work with PMS. I think I have breakthrough mania during that time of the month and breakthrough witchiness. Hmm maybe that will come in handy for my audtion. I am auditioning for The Witch! hehe Well, anyway, I am off to the shower! Have a wonderful but chilly or warm, day! Depending on where you are. :)
Posted by rainy on December 6, 2004, at 10:45:19
In reply to Re: Heads up, posted by bridgey1128 on December 6, 2004, at 8:33:21
A mitzvah, as I understand it, is a good deed or act of kindness done anonymously. Sol Gordon is/was a psychologist who specialzed in working with adoloscent issues back in the early 70s. He focused especially on depression and human sexuality. Sol suggested that people who are depressed will feel better if they do a Mitzvah and learn something new each day. He called this combination "Mitzvah therapy," and I recommend it highly.
rainy
I don't have your message in front of me, Bidgey, so Idon't want to screw up my response. Good luck with your audition!
Posted by headachequeen on December 6, 2004, at 15:01:37
In reply to Re: Heads up » redscarlet, posted by rainy on December 6, 2004, at 5:34:17
> Rainy, the one day at a time theory is not just for AA or a great song title, it is a way of life that everyone needs to embrace.
Sometimes it should be one hour at a time or one minute at a time.
The mitzvah therapy needs to extend to one's self too, I think. We are so busy thinking of other people and doing for other people and thinking of what we can do next for other people that we forget that there is a great need in the person doing and thinking for others...
Frankly if this mitzvah therapy were all that successful I should be the healthiest happiest person on earth...
Most of my time is spent in the doing and thinking and planning what next to do for the person I can help and not worrying if that person knows or cares what has been done; I want to help because that is how I function best...
of course, of late, functioning at all has been an exercise in chaos I must admit...
smiling is fun... and it catches people off guard...
try it some time when you are walking down the street... smile as you are walking and direct the smile at the next person walking toward you... some people actually smile back -- a little shocked but they smile, others almost hide in their coats or scarves or whatever and some are wonderful as they almost walk into parked cars or buildings trying to figure out what is going on...
and it makes you chuckle and feel better...but on the serious side, it is important to try the mitzvah therapy on yourself... take a little time to be good to you... it may be the most important thing you do that day because if you can't be good to you you can't be good for anyone...
kat
Posted by stresser on December 6, 2004, at 18:56:19
In reply to Re: Heads up, posted by headachequeen on December 6, 2004, at 15:01:37
Ok, I don't know where I have been, but what is Mitzvah therapy?
My daughter is finally up to 300mg of topamax.....I went ahead and bumped her on up becuase it was time and she changed doc's. Let's hope something happens. Anyway, the new doc says that Binge Eating comes from a feeling of the person "not being heard" (sometimes), and I can actually see how that can be. He didn't seem to want to take her off the topamax, he asked her if it was working, and she said she thought so. He is really different than her other doc, so things may be shaken up quite a bit. This will be good. I really liked this guy, he has seven kids, so he KNOWS kids. She will see the Pdoc. in Jan. for the medication adjustment. I'm keeping my fingers crossed on that one too. Good luck Bridgey on you audition!! If I only had talent!! -L
Posted by rainy on December 7, 2004, at 21:08:03
In reply to Re: Heads up, posted by stresser on December 6, 2004, at 18:56:19
anybody, what have been your experiences with effexor? weight gain? withdrawal syndrome? does it work?
rainy
Posted by MKB on December 7, 2004, at 21:20:14
In reply to effexor, posted by rainy on December 7, 2004, at 21:08:03
You should read the long thread on Effexor right under your post. Weight gain -yes. Terrible withdrawal problems - yes.
Other side effects are high blood pressure, dry skin and eyes, stomach upset, liver damage, somnolence, fatigue, dizziness, and more. Please don't start it without doing a LOT or research.
Posted by rainy on December 8, 2004, at 10:05:56
In reply to Re: effexor » rainy, posted by MKB on December 7, 2004, at 21:20:14
Thanks. Wonderful--you confirm what I've been reading. The other choice is Abilify--an antipsychotic used to treat mania in schizophrenia. One main adverse effect of that drug is one's tongue darting in and out of one's mouth like mine has been starting to do on trazodone. Plus, I'm depressed, not manic.
Can't win for losing.
rainy
Posted by bridgey1128 on December 8, 2004, at 10:33:38
In reply to Re: effexor » MKB, posted by rainy on December 8, 2004, at 10:05:56
rainy, are you JUST depressed or are you bipolar? I am horrid with names!! Sometimes I can't remember which person has which. I you all had pictures I could! :P I took Effexor, and it is horrid. STAY AWAY!!! EEK!! Why has the trazodone turned you into a lizard? Are your lips dry or is a psychological thing to lick your lips? I've never tried it so I have no experience with that one. There are SOOO many antidepressants out there, don't give up! You'll find one that works!
Posted by MKB on December 8, 2004, at 11:07:52
In reply to Re: effexor » MKB, posted by rainy on December 8, 2004, at 10:05:56
Ask your doctor if Tryptophan would help you. You can buy it without a prescription at www.healthrecovery.com, but some doctors prescribe it. It works better for me than Zoloft, Paxil, Serzone, Effexor, Depakote, or Wellbutrin, all of which I've tried. I am NOT talking about the 5HTP form. I'm talking about pharmaceutical grade L-Tryptophan. There are quite a few posts about it on the Psycho Babble Alternative board.
You can also read about it at the website I mentioned and at Wikipedia online.
Posted by bridgey1128 on December 8, 2004, at 11:18:50
In reply to Re: effexor » rainy, posted by MKB on December 8, 2004, at 11:07:52
Triptophan is what is in turkey and bananas that makes you sleepy. Does the prescription or OTC not make you just really sleepy? I would be afraid it would just knock you out and not have any other effect other than just making you so laid back you didn't care. Isn't that called somnolence?
Posted by MKB on December 8, 2004, at 11:21:21
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by bridgey1128 on December 8, 2004, at 11:18:50
It doesn't make you sleepy during the day. You take it at bedtime and it helps you sleep, but you wake up refreshed and alert.
Posted by PoohBear on December 8, 2004, at 18:41:03
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by bridgey1128 on December 8, 2004, at 11:18:50
> Triptophan is what is in turkey and bananas that makes you sleepy. Does the prescription or OTC not make you just really sleepy? I would be afraid it would just knock you out and not have any other effect other than just making you so laid back you didn't care. Isn't that called somnolence?
The main reason people get "sleepy" after eating turkey is not the l-tryptophan necessarily, nut the massive amount of food that normally goes along with a traditional turkey dinner. All that food hitting your gut causes your body to shift your blood supply to your stomach and away from your head, causing you to feel drowsy.
Tony
Posted by stresser on December 8, 2004, at 19:23:26
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by PoohBear on December 8, 2004, at 18:41:03
I was just reading the posts about effexor, and am wondering what the bad side effects are. My daughter was put on it for a short time one summer ago, but didn't stay on it long enough for any bad side effects to take place....thank goodness.
I am thinking about buying some 1-tryptophan for myself and trying it, because the welbutrin isn't working anymore, and I don't know if there's anyting out there that will. What are the side effects from that? I do need the sleep at night.....that would be a plus!!!-L
Posted by MKB on December 9, 2004, at 1:42:44
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by stresser on December 8, 2004, at 19:23:26
L-Tryptophan is worth a try. I'm sticking with it as there are no bad side-effects. You might have some weird dreams in the beginning. Pharmaceutical L-tryptophan is what you want to try to get, not the 5HTP. You'll probably have to purchase it online. There are several websites that offer it. I get mine from www.healthrecovery.com.
Posted by headachequeen on December 9, 2004, at 12:42:08
In reply to effexor, posted by rainy on December 7, 2004, at 21:08:03
> anybody, what have been your experiences with effexor? weight gain? withdrawal syndrome? does it work?
>
> rainyI don't remember all the side effects that were listed with the brochure the pharmacist gave me with the effexor the first time I was given it, but I do remember her warning me that it would cause weight gain and it did...
it did turn me into a zombie and of course it was the wrong medication for the situation as we know now...
although it did help at the time as I was really becoming stressed, almost panic-stricken given the circumstances surrounding the seizures I was having... the loss of days and so on...
When I decided it was time to stop taking it, I quit it and zyprexa at the same time
simply quit taking them ...
decided as I walked home that I was not happy with them and that they were doing nothing but suppressing my emotions so that it was time to stop.
I had no problems with the stopping...
no withdrawal symptoms, no reactions, nothing, although I was told afterward that many people have a terrible time coming off either and or both...it is not something I would recommend for a person with weight problems and not something I would recommend based on what I learned from my doctors after I quit 'cold turkey'...
had I known what could happen before I quit I would have been much more cautious -- and about starting to take it in the first place
kat
Posted by headachequeen on December 9, 2004, at 12:47:35
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by PoohBear on December 8, 2004, at 18:41:03
> > Triptophan is what is in turkey and bananas that makes you sleepy. Does the prescription or OTC not make you just really sleepy? I would be afraid it would just knock you out and not have any other effect other than just making you so laid back you didn't care. Isn't that called somnolence?
>
> The main reason people get "sleepy" after eating turkey is not the l-tryptophan necessarily, nut the massive amount of food that normally goes along with a traditional turkey dinner. All that food hitting your gut causes your body to shift your blood supply to your stomach and away from your head, causing you to feel drowsy.
>
> Tony
>
>Triptophan in turkey has been identified as being something that does cause one to be drowsy... and it is present in bananas too... one of the reasons they recommend bananas or a turkey sandwich as a bedtime snack for certain people
for instance, with certain tests that are coming up, I cannot take any meds that are meant to induce sleep by turning off the brain as it takes two to three weeks to eliminate them from the system but I am allowed to have a banana or two before bed because of the triptophan ... even a turkey sandwich as long as I don't eat the bread...
kat
Posted by ask on December 9, 2004, at 23:42:56
In reply to effexor, posted by rainy on December 7, 2004, at 21:08:03
I'm not sure if the Effexor is helping my depression. My level of depression seems to be more affected by my general attitude based on what's going on in my life than on the medication. Has anyone felt this too? If so, what did you do to fix the problem? Up the med? Taper it down and start a new med?
Many thanks.
Posted by rainy on December 10, 2004, at 4:37:09
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by ask on December 9, 2004, at 23:42:56
Hi, ask. You've posed a big question; can I ask you a couple in return? What's your diagnosis and who made it--a psychiatrist or your family practitioner? How long have you been on Effexor? I guess all these meds have a poop out factor. Also, it takes time to find the right medication.
If you're willing, would you share a little more about your situation?
rainy
Posted by rainy on December 10, 2004, at 6:01:27
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by ask on December 9, 2004, at 23:42:56
Anybody had experience with trileptal as a mood stabilizer? Adverse effects?
rainy
Posted by iris2 on December 10, 2004, at 11:51:28
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by ask on December 9, 2004, at 23:42:56
I would think that if your mood is generally more affected by outside influences than medication than you should consider therapy and learn how not to get depressed about things in your life. If you are able to change your reactions and not be depressed or anxious or whatever than you should not have a need for medication. Too many of us reach for medication and do not try to solve things with diet, exersise, and therapy. It is a simpler more long term and healthier answer if it can be occomplished. Medications should be the last resort not the first. Another thing to remember is that everyone experiences bad times in life and it does not always mean there is something wrong.
irene
Posted by bridgey1128 on December 10, 2004, at 15:21:58
In reply to Re: effexor » ask, posted by iris2 on December 10, 2004, at 11:51:28
I agree. If you know what makes you depressed. Don't do those things. Stay away from those things. Just from what you said it makes me wonder why you need medication. It sounds like you would better benefit from a counselor than any kind of meds. Maybe herbal stuff at the worst. Massage therapy, exercise. Things that naturally boost your body's endorphines. THat and Effexor is horrid horrid stuff. BE CAREFUL when you come off or you will have some BAD BAD stuff. Brain shivers are what I had. Where you feel like someone just took your head and shook it. Randomly. I am bipolar or I wish I didn't have to take medication. People act like I CHOOSE to take it, like I just LOVE taking medication or it's a cop out. Oh yeah, I just LOVE spending extra money I don't have every month!! :P Riiiiight. Also, do you take your B vitamins? That is another thing to consider. If there is any other way besides medication and you can do it, DO IT! :)
Posted by rainy on December 14, 2004, at 5:42:35
In reply to Re: effexor, posted by bridgey1128 on December 10, 2004, at 15:21:58
Week two of titrating up from 300 to 400 mgs Topamax. This from a woman who wanted to go down to 200. I've been at 325 for a week without too much serious forgetfulness (other than letting our expensive, anniversary present tea kettle boil dry)and plan to stay here for another week before upping to 350. It was at 350 last year that I became disorented while driving and couldn't hold my own in a conversation, so I'm leery of it.
Down to 200 mgs wellbutrin (unless I forget to take the PM dose, then it's 100) and I'm experiencing less anxiety. I want to try niacinimide, magnesium and taurine--as in cat food, move over kitties--for anxiety before I go back to pdoc in late December. The search for a new one, pdoc, is fizzling--my referrals either cost $225 per visit or require therapy as adjunct. Can't afford. I'm considering disability; at least I could afford medication.
If the natural stuff doesn't work then I think I'll ask her if trileptal is OK as an add on mood stabilizer. From what I've been reading on Psych Education or another site, a lot of bipolar people aren't on ADs at all-just mood stabilizers and anti-psychotics.
I'm realizing that I don't know as much as i thought I did about bipolar disorder and medication--when pdoc suggested Abilify, I sort of freaked--"I'm not psychotic--yet!" I need to read some more. I also didn't know how this site worked--like I've thought up until this week that this thread was the med board. Talk about provincial.
Hoo boy.Thanks for all your feed back about Effexor. No way will I take it.
Kat, where art thou???
Stresser, how's M doing on the higher dose of topamax? Any cognitive problems?
merry, how are you and the holidays getting along?
rainy
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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