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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
Hi again, i spoke to my doctor on the telephone and told him about what i said here etc, he said he wishes he can help me, but he isnt a mental health profesional and thats why he refered me to the mental health center, he reasured me that he has written to them 4 times, 4 TIMES withint the last 8 mnths !!!! and still to no avail have i heared anything, i said to him this is rediculous etc etc, he said for me to just hang in there with my remeron, i told him the way i am feeling and about this board, he said to me to ask you lot if you know of any med he can try me on for my depression, anxiety, panick attacks and awfull obsessive paranoid thoughts !! i am currently on remeron, i have tryed all other ssri's effexor (the worst) paxil, prozac, zoloft, celexa, etc etc all caused my bp to go to high, trylics caused me to basiclly fel as if my heart were to stop !! and valuim gave me a panick reaction at one time and i aint touched it since !! he said to me there is no pint sticking me on another ssri due to that fact it will have the same reaction all the other ssri's i have had, and the same with trylics, he said it would be a bad idea to have another benzo due to the suicidal risk, as it is a depressant, and he will not stick me on an maoi as that will defintly make my bp go high!! i asked about lithium he said no to that as that will also apparently make me more suicidal as studys have shown it is a depressant for manic patients, also i asked him about an antiphsycotic, he said that could be an answer for my awful evil paranoid obsessive thoughts!! BUT again it could cause phsycosis, i had to laff cus i could here him going hmm hmmm and turning pages in his book, looking up the meds i was telling him about .. lol... so anyways i am asking for your help, have i any options left?
I suffering with panick attacks on a daily basis especially when i am out of my house, anxiety to the point where i can not calm down BUT i do have proponol for that if it gets way out of hand along with breathing exercises, depression is creeping up on me due to the fact i feel remeron is starting to poop out and for the fact i am being messed about by the physciatrist, (ignorant bitch) and these evil, obssive paranoid thoughts r the worst, i have outburts of moods i am very short tempered especially to my sweet little girl who i know loves me as she hates going to school as she misses me.......
Any help plse?
Thanx again Donna
Posted by john1022 on January 5, 2004, at 18:58:03
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
"i asked about lithium he said no to that as that will also apparently make me more suicidal as studys have shown it is a depressant for manic patients"
wish I could help you out more with a suggestion, but lithium is known as a very good med for stopping suicidal thoughts.
I tried lithium orotate and for some reason it actually helped with my depression. I have read it helps raise serotonin levels. But it can make depression worse in some cases (think it is through decreasing dopamine).
Posted by zeugma on January 5, 2004, at 19:19:45
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
Is psychosis really listed as a side effect of antipsychotics? I can understand why you laughed...
But people here have said antipsychotics are the best at calming down severe agitation and paranoid thoughts.
Hang in there...
z
Posted by brussell on January 5, 2004, at 20:28:59
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by zeugma on January 5, 2004, at 19:19:45
For your symptoms, you would get the most relief from an antipsychotic.
I strongly suggest trying Zyprexa. I'm not sure if it has a different name in the UK--the generic name is olanzapine. It is an antipsychotic that I have taken in the past for extremely severe anxiety, paranoid thinking, and disturbing violent thoughts. It worked really well for me.
I have never heard of an antipsychotic "causing" psychosis. Maybe your doctor is thinking of a neuroleptic malignant syndrome caused by going off a high dose too quickly. This is definitely not something you need to worry about.
I'm sorry you're having such a hard time getting care. I'm glad your doctor is willing to prescribe something.
I would suggest starting with olanzapine (Zyprexa) because it is very good for anxiety and didn't make me sleepy. I would start with one 5mg tablet/day or two a day if one is not enough.
There are many other good antipsychotics available, like risperdone (Risperdal), aripiprazole (Abilify), and quetiapine fumarate (Seroquel) (the last one makes most people very sleepy, though).
Posted by brussell on January 5, 2004, at 20:50:06
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
Hi Donna,
I just wanted to add something about antidepressants. I take a MAOI (Parnate in the US) and it helped my anxiety so much that my bp went down twenty points (to a healthier range). It also was the first drug that really helped my depression.
MAOI's don't cause high blood pressure unless you eat aged cheese, red wine, or certain other kinds of aged foods. You also have to avoid many certain medications. There is a list on the www.dr-bob.org homepage.
As long as you can follow the MAOI diet (which has been very easy for me), MAOI's are a really good option for people who have had bad luck with the SSRIs and the other AD's you have tried.
If you want to try a MAOI, I would suggest phenelzine (Nardil) since it seems to work for the most people. You would need to stop the Remeron and wait two weeks before starting it, though. Remeron is one of the many drugs you can't take when taking a MAOI.
Good luck, and don't give up. You will find something that works.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 5, 2004, at 22:44:29
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by brussell on January 5, 2004, at 20:28:59
I'd have to agree that an antipsychotic would help. Psychosis??? I don't understand where your doctor got that... But, I have tried Zyprexa, Risperdal, Seroquel, Abilify and Geodon. The one that I had the best results on was Abilify. I didn't find it to be sedating at all!! I started out on 10 mgs and worked up to 15 mgs. Geodon caused me to develope akathesia, which is a sort of restlessness (I guess is a way to describe it??). It is very uncomfortable, to say the least!! The only thing that I have to say about Zyprexa is that I found it to be very sedating personally. When I took it, I was knocked out within the hour. And I put on some weight from taking it. I didn't find Abilify to be sedating at all, and found no side effects from it. But, I can tolerate medications fairly easily as well. Geodon didn't produce any side effects either, aside from the akathesia. But, this is my personal experience, and bear in mind that I tolerate medication VERY well!!
I'd try an antipsychotic!!
Posted by crazychickuk on January 6, 2004, at 3:41:36
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL... » brussell, posted by Karen_kay on January 5, 2004, at 22:44:29
OH THANKYOU ONECE AGAIN, YOU ARE ALL SO VERY GOOD....
I so want to try an antphsicotic med, i laffed cus i could her my doctor the otherend of the fone going hmm hmm and turning pages in his book, he is so funny in that way, it just made me laff for ages.. he trys to cheer ppl up he really is a nice and a cool doctor, he said something that an antiphsycotic can cause phsycosis when used at higher doses, I am just worried that it may either react badly with me along with taking remeron, i dont want to feel to sleepy cus thats when i cant be bothered with life, if you get me? i so want to try one, i really do, zyprexa seems to be the one that alot of ppl have taken for severe anxiety and paranoid thoughts, i will have a good chat face to face with my doc, if i can keep a straight face, he is just one of those ppl who you have to laff at, i will see what he thinks, i am so nervous in trying it, i have so many bad reactions with others, my bp is always raised, remeron is the only med that has ever helped me!!!! god plse i pray to you to help me!! thanx again guys.... any more opnions will be much appreciated.. : )
Posted by dragonfly25 on January 6, 2004, at 8:07:25
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
hi
i had experiences with anti psychotics, and a couple did induce a psychotic reaction. i initially took it for depression/sleep and the dose was raised to high. i eventually strarted having the symptoms that people have who usually take the drug. we tried 3. it was a very scary experience! i concluded that it was b/c i didn't have any real reason to take it to begin with so it was having a reverse reaction on me. creating what it couldn't fix. (i dunno??) but i think it is a rare experience. this was just me and i am drug sensitive, i am not trying to discourage the use of them at all.
i would talk to him about lithium again, it can be VERY helpful and i would also talk to him about an anti-psychotic. not about taking both at once but it sounds like he needs to be more open to the options, it is weird he is turning his nose on everything. anti-psychotics can be very helpful to people, but be prepared for side effects. i find it is more helpful to know in advance what to expect so you can try to counter it.
good luck
Posted by DanielJ on January 6, 2004, at 12:40:30
In reply to anti-psychotics can induce psychosis...not often , posted by dragonfly25 on January 6, 2004, at 8:07:25
If you succeed in getting on to an AP. I would recommend Zyprexa first. Probably a lower dosage might be OK like 5 MG. It probably will slow you down right away. You will want to sleep and eat more but maybe not. Delusions, obsessions and paranoia will go away eventually but if you don't have a major MI like BP or Schiz. then be careful APs are for Psychotic symptoms (and if you have them they should be recognized and treated). Zoloft should work well for panic attack but sometimes it takes a sizeable amt like 75 to 100 mg to be successful. Give these at least 2-3 months because they can take that long before they become fully effective. Both of these meds can cause sleepiness at the outset, so if you drive, look out. I assume you would be getting these from a Psy Dr.. This combo works well a relative of mine but probably wouldn't be right for everyone.
Good Luck!
Posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 16:29:25
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 6, 2004, at 3:41:36
i dont want to feel to sleepy cus thats when i cant be bothered with life
*Ok, I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Now, I am able to tolerate medications VERY VERY well!!! With VERY LITTLE side effects! And that is no joke. I'm very lucky that way. And in my earlier post, I stated that I have tried Zyprexa, Geodon, Risperdal, Seroquel, and Abilify. Zyprexa made me very tired the whole time I took it. I can't quite recall the exact dose I took, that may play a role. But, I honestly don't think it was a high dose. I had the best results on Geodon and Abilify. Neither made me tired or gave me any kind of side effects. With the exception of Geodon, which gave me akathesia. But, I don't hold a grudge :) If you are worried about becoming tired, I would highly suggest Geodon, Risperdal or Abilify. None of these made me tired in the slightest. Nor did I develope any side effects (with the exception of akathesia, which could have happened with any of these.)
Good luck with your decision. My Pdoc just told me that these are the ones that are least likely to cause sedation and from my experience, this is true.
Posted by jms600 on January 6, 2004, at 17:29:10
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
I've never heard of anti-psychotics causing psychosis nor have I heard of Lithium causing depression. I checked the BNF and it certainly didn't mention anything about Lithium causing depression, but it did include lethargy and "sluggishness" as side effects.
Lithium is given to help both manic episodes and bouts of deep depression. A friend of mine suffers from BP1 and has been hospitalized several times due to it before she tried Lithium. She has been on Lithium and a low dose of Stelazine (an anti-psychotic) for a few years now and hasn't looked back since!
If I were you, I'd certainly insist on seeing another P/doc, the one you are with at the moment sounds as if she should be struck off!!
Best wishes.
Posted by TheOutsider on January 6, 2004, at 17:34:48
In reply to My experience with Zyprexa » crazychickuk, posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 16:29:25
Sorry to be discouraging, but to the best of my knowladge abilify is not available here.
Amisulpride is though!
Posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 19:58:07
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by jms600 on January 6, 2004, at 17:29:10
Well, lithium has a calming effect. So, if she isn't bipolar I could see how there could be a chance that it could cause her to become depressed. But, some people who don't respond well to regular AD's do respond to lithium. It's just a trial and error thing. I could see how it could cause her to become even more depressed, because lithium is better at treating manic episodes than depressive episodes.
Posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 19:59:30
In reply to Abilify is not available in UK, posted by TheOutsider on January 6, 2004, at 17:34:48
Then I'd say go for Geodon..Ziprasidone Is that available? If I were her, I'd try an MAOI plus an antipsychotic... What about you?
Posted by bipolarspectrum on January 6, 2004, at 22:49:44
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
Hello crazychick,
I have also been through a similar myriad of psychopharmaceuticals.. I am a bipolar (possibly type III) and I experienced manic responses to wellbutrin and nardil.. For you, I would recommend a combo which has recently become more popular, prozac and zyprexa (fluoxetine and olanzapine).. I like to think it may help with your OCD and the anti-psychotic should, hypothetically, keep the mania at bay... plus, the zyprexa may help with insomnia caused by prozac..
good luck
bipolarspectrum
ps. is there a reason, beside the weather, to explain the general sadness in England?
Posted by cybercafe on January 7, 2004, at 9:27:19
In reply to Re: Abilify is not available in UK » TheOutsider, posted by Karen_kay on January 6, 2004, at 19:59:30
> Then I'd say go for Geodon..Ziprasidone Is that available? If I were her, I'd try an MAOI plus an antipsychotic... What about you?
yeah parnate + zyprexa was an awesome combination for me
Posted by Karen_kay on January 7, 2004, at 10:01:45
In reply to Re: Abilify is not available in UK, posted by cybercafe on January 7, 2004, at 9:27:19
The zyprexa didn't sedate you? It's just that I'm really very tolerant to medications and zyprexa for some reason sedated me almost immediately. And I really don't think I was on a high dose. I know that Geodon, Risperdal and Abilify didn't. And I think that in her post she expressed concern about sedation. Just curious..
Posted by Sebastian on January 7, 2004, at 11:59:05
In reply to I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by crazychickuk on January 5, 2004, at 17:44:29
try zyprexa. works great.
Posted by crazychickuk on January 7, 2004, at 12:03:54
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..., posted by Sebastian on January 7, 2004, at 11:59:05
THANX GUYS AGAIN xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Will zyprexa be available in the uk? also what are the side affects? will it raise my bp like the ssri's? also will it help with my depression cus i fel my depression is at its worst now...
Thankyou
Posted by caroline on January 8, 2004, at 13:01:07
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..zyprexa, posted by crazychickuk on January 7, 2004, at 12:03:54
Hi again,
It's definitely available in the UK. My brother's on it. I believe it can cut it with particularly torturing depression, probably depends on dose and individual brain chemistry though ...
Best, Caroline
Posted by Sebastian on January 9, 2004, at 11:59:37
In reply to Re: I SPOKE TO DOC HE SAID TO ASK YOU ALL..zyprexa, posted by crazychickuk on January 7, 2004, at 12:03:54
It should not raise your BP, doc says, it didn't seem to raise mine. I do have a little problem with BP but I blame it on wellbutrin. Thats when I started having problems. I was taking zp for 5 previous years, and never the problem.
It is supposed to help as an ant-depresant. But I take celexa an SSRI for that.
This is the end of the thread.
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