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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by cathal on September 26, 2003, at 11:37:14
In reply to Re: Adderall advise! » cathal, posted by loolot on September 24, 2003, at 12:00:25
the real symptoms of ADD are somewhat confusing to people who don't have it or don't live with someone who has it. they think it's all controlable and behavioral personality stuff
there are three types recognized in the DSM-IV, ADHD (attention deficit hyperactivity disorder), ADD, (no hyperactivity) and combined type (just what it says, half the time you are hyper, the other half not). people often miss plain ADD because it's the hyperactivity and running around that tips off most parents. plain ADD is kids who just daydream and stare out the window and do all the same stuff as ADHD but without the running around. SOME of the symptoms of adult ADD/ADHD include:-inability to organize thoughts
-losing things, misplacing things
-low tolerance for frustration, easily upset
-short fuse, explosive temper
-ability to hyperfocus at times and ignore all around you
-high level of what we call novelty seeking behavior (sometimes thrill seeking) such as downloading porn at work and risking getting caught, driving recklessly, promiscuity, petty crime
-leaving lots of messes and projects lying around, never finishing them
-feeling self doubt and insecurity because you can't finish things and you must be 'defective' or otherwise people wouldn't be mad at you
-finishing people's sentences, talking over them in conversationhmmmm, i'd be looking at the depression more than the ADD and you might not have ADD at all. it's true ADD can co-exist with depression, but consider two things.
1. everybody focuses on the 'classic' symptoms of depression: being suicidal, hopeless, etc. Other common symptoms we use in depression screening include irritibility, restlessness, disrupted sleep patterns, lack of ability to focus or pay attention.
2. people get mad at health care professionals for using esoteric terms but keep in mind that you can have an attention deficit without having ADD. you can have chronic headaches without having a brain tumor, you know? and a woman can throw up in the morning and not be pregnant. one is a condition the other is a SYMPTOM of the condition. lots of people have an attention deficit, that just means they have trouble paying attention and it can be for a variety of reasons which is why all those reasons have to be screened out before diagnosing ADD. ADD is a cluster of symptoms, not just attention deficit, but attention deficit coupled with things like (i'm reaching for my DSM-IV and quoting here) : "often fails to give close attention to details or makes careless mistakes in work or other activities...often has difficulty organizing tsks...often loses things necessary for tasks...often talks excessively..."
so just having an attention deficit doesn't mean one has ADD. personally, i'd focus more on treating your depression. too bad SSRIs seem tohave a bad effect on you. have you tried Lexapro? this is the latest miracle drug and, from my experience, seems to be quite effective in treating people with atypical depression or who can't take SSRI's
Posted by cathal on September 26, 2003, at 11:40:52
In reply to Re:differences in Add and Bi-polar , posted by Kacy on September 25, 2003, at 13:23:38
all true and for me, one of the keys to a diagnosis of bipolar over ADD are the EMOTIONAL swings, not mental problems. bipolar disorder is classified as a mood disorder which is why when someone is on an "up" we see a lot of giddiness, silliness, laughing, ecstatic excited moods REGARDLESS of what their thoughts are and when they cycle down we see depression, hopelessness, bleak outlook, crying unhappiness, despondency no matter waht they are thinking
Posted by bige on September 26, 2003, at 14:24:44
In reply to Re:adult addhd, posted by cathal on September 26, 2003, at 11:29:41
I have a question for those guys out there who are on Strattera. I seem to be having difficulty having an orgasam, but I have a lot of semen coming out at the begining of the "activity" rather than at the end when it is supposed to. Sorry for the question but it is easier on here than at the Dr.
Posted by loolot on September 26, 2003, at 22:52:44
In reply to Re: Adderall advise!, posted by cathal on September 26, 2003, at 11:37:14
>
> so just having an attention deficit doesn't mean one has ADD. personally, i'd focus more on treating your depression. too bad SSRIs seem tohave a bad effect on you. have you tried Lexapro? this is the latest miracle drug and, from my experience, seems to be quite effective in treating people with atypical depression or who can't take SSRI's
Thanks a lot for the info! Sounds like a lot of people are having similar problems. I actually have started taking cytomel, and it seems to be helping a little, esp with energy.
I am going to try the adderall next and then Ill figure out if I should try something else instead.
I have heard of Lexapro. What is it exactly (what does it work on in the brain). Are there side effects?
Posted by sailor on September 28, 2003, at 21:04:36
In reply to Re: Adderall advise!, posted by loolot on September 26, 2003, at 22:52:44
Have been taking Strattera 80mg for 1 month, along with 50 mg lamotrigine (lamictal) for long-term major, treatment resistand depression. Noticed a strong positive initial response to the Strattera (at that time the lamictal was only a small starter dose). Am taking the 80 mg Str. in the AM. Lately, feel that the effect is waning, though I'm still definitely less depressedx and more alert than when I started. See my NP tomorrow, and after reading others' posts, will suggest my going to 100 mg. Also don't know if the lamictal is really doing anything, though it is supposed to augment the Str. Of course, when you're in a drug combo, there's no sure way to know which is doing what, and/or what the synergistic effects might be. More art than science to psych Rx ? Have experienced urinary retention (swollen prostate?) and some constipation, but otherwise am hopeful about the Strattera. Thanks everyone for the posts. Regards, sailorman.
Posted by cathal on September 29, 2003, at 11:34:37
In reply to Re:adult addhd, posted by cathal on September 26, 2003, at 11:29:41
that happens to me on zoloft. other things i have experienced on zoloft re: sexual side effects:
- difficulty getting an erection
- difficulty maintaining an erection
- penis feels desensitized
- orgasm is less intense
- difficulty achieving an orgasmand there's no pattern to it. i was with a woman where i had NO problem getting a very full erection and it would stay for an hour but i couldn't achieve orgasm easily - great for her.
Posted by Doug E on September 29, 2003, at 17:13:39
In reply to Straterra approval., posted by scoper on December 28, 2002, at 2:19:34
I was just prescribed Straterra today. For a long time I thought I just had Dysthymia (chronic low-grade depression)and several months ago I decided to give anti-depressants a try. First was Paxil. After 5 or 6 weeks there was little result. Then Zoloft. Again, after 6 weeks I saw little improvement. A month ago saw a therapist who specializes in Adults with ADD and I realized that all the "daydreaming, procrastination, trouble focusing, difficulty with repetetive tasks, etc." that I have experienced since childhood have been a major stumbling block.
So today I have started with Stratera. I am encouraged by what Jim Boardman and Nicole have posted. I am starting with 25g for 4 days, then 40g for 5 days, with a taget dosage of 40g 2Xday.
I have a question: Do I need to taper off of Zoloft while I am starting the Stratera or do I just stop?
Thanks,
Doug
Posted by frustratedmom on September 30, 2003, at 16:27:49
In reply to Re: promises, promises, posted by Nachoman on August 11, 2003, at 21:03:16
> > Lots of people are telling me to be patient with
> > Strattera, and it's probably good advise. I'm
> > worried about struggling through school when I
> > start in September, though. There's quite a bit
> > of pressure to find a medicine that works ASAP.
> >
> > If there's anyone out there who has the
> > inattentive type of ADD - feeling spacey,
> > disorganized, and tired all the time. I'd like
> > to hear what medicine, if any, is working for
> > you.
>
> **** REPLY ****
>
> I was diagnosed with ADD just over a year ago -- I believe the inattentive type.
>
> I started on Adderall 20mg and the improvement was dramatic and immediate. Literally the day I started taking it I was able to focus on one thing for a long period of time. Actually, it was a little scary how focused I was -- I've never before been so productive. I also stopped drinking alcohol (used to have 1 or 2 drinks/day), stopped drinking coffee (4-5 cups/day) and stopped smoking (only ~5/day) -- all cold-turkey. I just didn't crave them anymore. Now instead of going out for a smoke and pacing to help think through a problem, I could just think about it at my desk and get things done.
>
> The next 6 months were great. I was taking 10mg in the morning and 10mg at noon. The problem was that it wore off by 5pm or so, and so I was back to my regular ADD-self (sans the cravings) by the time I got home from work. I didn't *feel* a difference -- I just had a hard time concentrating again.
>
> I then switched to Adderall XR 20mg (10 in the morning, 10 at noon) in an attempt to extend the effects into the evening. It generally worked, but overall I didn't notice as much of an improvement as with the regular Adderall. It was a little frustrating, so even though I didn't like the idea of it, I started to think about asking my doc if I could increase the dose to 30mg.
>
> Before I did, however, my doc told me about Strattera. I did a bunch of research on it, including reading through all the posts in this thread (thank you everyone) and it sounded great. I started with a sample pack (25mg for 4 days, then 40mg for a week, then 80mg) while continuing to take Adderall XR, 10mg only.
>
> It's been about 2 months with Strattera 80mg (once in morning) and over a month since I stopped Adderall altogether.
>
> As far as I can tell, the Strattera is having no (or very little) positive effect on me. I'm back to my old-self, constantly flipping between various things and never really concentrating on one thing at a time. There are some times when it feels like my ADD symptoms are lessened, but it usually only lasts for a couple of hours. The good majority of the time, I feel like it's doing almost nothing for me. The one exception is that I don't feel incredibly tired in the afternoon like I used to before I started Adderall.
>
> I had some side effects when I first started (insomnia, dry-mouth/eyes, itchy scalp) but those were short-lived and are pretty much gone now. I still have two side effects: no appetite and a sexual side effect, but I'm willing to live with those to see if Strattera can work for me eventually.
>
> It's quite frustrating having to deal with my ADD symptoms after knowing what it's like without them, but I really want to give Strattera a chance. I've heard that in some cases it can take 3 or more months for it to really take effect. I'm also going to ask my doc if I can increase the dose to 100 or 120. I don't weigh a lot, but I have a very high metabolism, so perhaps my effective dose is higher than the average. I'm willing to give Strattera up to 3 months before I decide to go back to Adderall.
>
> Anyways, I just wanted to share my experience with you. The quick fix for me was Adderall -- I'm hoping Strattera can work just as well, but it sure is taking a lot longer, if it ends up working at all.***REPLY***
I am the mother a a 15 year old boy who started on Adderall XR last August. The results were amazing. It was light flipping a light switch... finally he could focus and complete his school work.
This summer, we saw a tv ad promoting Straterra. We decided to give it a try, as we had heard so many negative associations with Adderall (potential side effects, stigma of being a controlled substance, turning our child into a drug addict). We were excited at the prospect of a non stimulant medicine having the same results.
We started the Straterra over the summer and he has been taking 54 mg daily (in the morning). It wasn't until school started up that he was able to observe the lack of benefit concerning real concentration. He notices a huge difference in the way he was able to perform on the Adderall as opposed to how he is performing or more accurately not performing on the Straterra.
Our Dr. has recommended increasing the dosage, again in 18mg increments. We are frustrated to learn of the level you have been taking, still showing no significant improvement.
How long do we wait and hope, while we watch his grades slip? It is frustrating knowing that the Adderall worked so well, and yet we have been made to feel bad about having him on that particular medicine. We would love to hear from others who are taking the same medicines and whether they have had positive results from Straterra and if so, how long did it take and what dosage are you taking. Thanks for listening.
Posted by bige on October 1, 2003, at 7:11:45
In reply to Re: promises, promises, posted by Nachoman on August 11, 2003, at 21:03:16
Finishing up my third year of law school in May. Patience is what you need on Strattera it has been about two months and it is working my writing has improved and my confidence has gotten better. The other part is the symptoms have all but disappeared. Hang in there it will work.Have confidence
Posted by frustratedmom on October 1, 2003, at 7:36:22
In reply to Re: promises, promises, posted by bige on October 1, 2003, at 7:11:45
Thank you (bige) for your encouragement. What dosage of Straterra are you taking? We are going up to72mg starting today. I am trying to be hopeful.
Posted by bige on October 1, 2003, at 10:08:01
In reply to Re: promises, promises, posted by frustratedmom on October 1, 2003, at 7:36:22
I am currenjtly taking 80 mil I take mione at night before bedtime and that helped me to alleviate a lot of the symptoms
Posted by frustratedmom on October 1, 2003, at 14:57:36
In reply to Re: promises, promises, posted by bige on October 1, 2003, at 10:08:01
Thanks (bige) for giving me the dosage you take. That means we are only 8mg behind what you are taking. What kind of symptoms did you experience that made you take it at night, rather than in the morning? My son has not really experienced any side effects thus far and he has been taking it for 3 months. Maybe the dosage hasn't been high enough to give him any to date.
Posted by Mike Oxsbig on October 1, 2003, at 15:32:35
In reply to Re:adult addhd, posted by bige on September 26, 2003, at 14:24:44
I don't know how long you've been on Strat. , but I think some of the problems lessen over time. Some will stay with you. I quit taking it.
Good luck
> I have a question for those guys out there who are on Strattera. I seem to be having difficulty having an orgasam, but I have a lot of semen coming out at the begining of the "activity" rather than at the end when it is supposed to. Sorry for the question but it is easier on here than at the Dr.
Posted by bige on October 1, 2003, at 18:56:35
In reply to Re:adult addhd, posted by bige on September 26, 2003, at 14:24:44
Thanks mikeoxbig for the info
Posted by Corny on October 2, 2003, at 12:35:07
In reply to Re: promises, promises : Straterra vs. Adderall XR, posted by frustratedmom on September 30, 2003, at 16:27:49
I tried Srattera on a couple of occaisons with no success at all.I couldn't stay with it very long because I had a lot of difficulty swallowing. I am back to working with Adderall.
Posted by readyforchange on October 2, 2003, at 12:42:29
In reply to Re: promises, promises : Straterra vs. Adderall XR » frustratedmom, posted by Corny on October 2, 2003, at 12:35:07
in response to the comment about difficulty swallowing - i know what you mean - i almost don't take my meds for fear i will choke on the pills and gag, and i hate that feeling. try taking it with juice to cut the gag reflex...
Posted by Kacy on October 2, 2003, at 15:11:32
In reply to Re: promises, promises : Straterra vs. Adderall XR, posted by readyforchange on October 2, 2003, at 12:42:29
Readyforchange: I have the same problem; sometimes, I choke and gag swallowing pills. Lately, I've had an easier time after drinking a full glass of water before trying to swallow any pills. Maybe it's a hydration thing. Also, I got a Brita pitcher. Since the water itself isn't as foul, I have been handling the pills better.
Posted by Corny on October 3, 2003, at 2:02:33
In reply to Re: promises, promises : Straterra vs. Adderall XR » frustratedmom, posted by Corny on October 2, 2003, at 12:35:07
I should make that prior post a little bit clearer. The problem isn't swallowing pills. Strattera seems to cause a swelling or restriction and creates a discomfort in swallowing. It takes me almost twice as long to eat a meal as I just can't it to go down.
Posted by readyforchange on October 3, 2003, at 11:16:08
In reply to Re: promises, promises : Straterra vs. Adderall XR, posted by readyforchange on October 2, 2003, at 12:42:29
in response to the last two posts regarding my message about swallowing pills... i think i suffer from both. i am taking 40mg Straterra right now ( i am suppose to take 60mg... working on it), with buspar for anxiety. i hadn't tied the two ailments together before, but now it makes sense. thanks :)
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 5, 2003, at 22:44:07
In reply to Strattera and fatigue: AM or PM dose?, posted by Trixie on August 29, 2003, at 14:25:13
[Posted by lerch on October 5, 2003, at 18:07:33]
> In response to Trixie's post of 8/29/03, I started taking Strattera with my evening meal several days ago for AADD. I immediately noticed the same effects on my ability to sleep that she had. I immediately started waking up every couple hours and, after about 4-5 hours of interrupted sleep, could no longer sleep at all.
> I did not have the fatigue problems that she mentioned.
>
> I also noticed about 30-36 hours after I started taking the drug that it became increasingly difficult to urinate or defecate normally. Regardless of the "urgency" of the situation, I could only urinate "slowly" and walked away frequently feeling like I should go more but could not. Having a complete bowel movement was also difficult. both problems seemed to worsen the longer I took the drug. According to Lilly's website, these are known side effects for some adults. My doctor did not mention this to me.
>
> I stopped taking the drug after 4 days. Within 30-36 hours, these side effects started to go away and, after an additional 24-36 hours, everything was back to normal.
>
>
Posted by perper on October 8, 2003, at 3:17:56
In reply to Actually, I thought reboxetine was GREAT! » Phil, posted by fairnymph on February 5, 2003, at 22:15:10
I have tried over a dozen AD's w mixed result, and basically minor side-effects. Reboxetine is the WORST I've tried. Felt like taking 10 cups of coffee in 2 minutes. I thought it would be good for my ADD symptoms, so I was quite dissapointed at the time. Strattera seem to offer much better hope. Will try it soon ( Not in Sweden yet, need to mailorder it here)
> I found reboxetine very effective for depression, stimulating, and free of side effects. It didn't help with my anxiety/OCD, but it was a fantastic med otherwise, one of the best I've tried (and I've tried half a dozen).
>
> > I should hope so, Reboxetine was a big flop with, I think, everyone on this site who tried it.
>
>
Posted by littlehope on October 9, 2003, at 5:19:16
In reply to Re: Actually, I thought reboxetine was GREAT!, posted by perper on October 8, 2003, at 3:17:56
> I have tried over a dozen AD's w mixed result, and basically minor side-effects. Reboxetine is the WORST I've tried. Felt like taking 10 cups of coffee in 2 minutes. I thought it would be good for my ADD symptoms, so I was quite dissapointed at the time. Strattera seem to offer much better hope. Will try it soon ( Not in Sweden yet, need to mailorder it here)
>I'm considering trying Strattera too. Does it have anticholinergic side-effects ?
(Hvor skaffer du Strattera fra ?)
Posted by deLane on October 9, 2003, at 17:59:44
In reply to Straterra approval., posted by scoper on December 28, 2002, at 2:19:34
I noticed that bige was in his third year of law school and is taking strattera. I am trying desperately to do well on my LSAT but am having difficulty concentrating on the passages without my mind wondering. Plus, I'm having to read over the statements continuously before I can even go to an answer. I went to the Dr today and he gave me a sample to try. I'm taking my LSAT on 12/6. I was supposed to take it on 10/4 but my score wasn't high enough due to my problem. How long is this going to take to kick in and how long will I have this side effect of an upset stomach? The upset stomach is pretty bad.
My Dr wouldn't put me on adderol because he said I would have to take numerous tests to see if I really had ADD. Did everyone else who is on this had to have a ton of tests before it was prescribed to them?
Just curious.....
Posted by perper on October 9, 2003, at 18:28:29
In reply to Re: fairnymph , posted by littlehope on October 9, 2003, at 5:19:16
> > I have tried over a dozen AD's w mixed result, and basically minor side-effects. Reboxetine is the WORST I've tried. Felt like taking 10 cups of coffee in 2 minutes. I thought it would be good for my ADD symptoms, so I was quite dissapointed at the time. Strattera seem to offer much better hope. Will try it soon ( Not in Sweden yet, need to mailorder it here)
> >
>
> I'm considering trying Strattera too. Does it have anticholinergic side-effects ?
> (Hvor skaffer du Strattera fra ?)It doesnt seem to interfer w cholinergic processes at all. Initial tiredness and loss of weight/reduced appetite, are common. As its been approved by FDA, it could be prescribed in Sweden on a license. Its a formality, and the drugs goes via "apoteket" the normal way. A fairly qucik process, like a few weeks. I know a stock is being hold by Lily here as there are clinical trilas going on. Call Lily in Norway to ask about clinical trials.
If I wont get them via my doctor, I'll get them from a foreign pharmacy who makes "mailorder". I have a few that I used in the past 4-5 years. The best one I used is in Argentina, but I am not sure weather they carry Strattera. Feel free to send me mail ([email protected]) I got treatment resistant mild depression for years, with ADD .
hej !
Per
Posted by bige on October 9, 2003, at 23:27:23
In reply to Re: Straterra approval., posted by deLane on October 9, 2003, at 17:59:44
Howdy No I didnt have to take tons of tests to get my diagnosis of ADHD but I have been diagnosed for ten years Dr.s now are being looked at more closely for drugs like Ritalin. The side efeccts will go away in around three weeks at least they did for me. I also took a Princton Review class for the LSAT and that helped I jumped 12 pts in my score. I know what you mean by forgetting the passages I still do that in Law School but I just keep reading over and over. Now that I have applied to take the Bar they are wanting more "functional limitation" eviedence before I am granted accomidations on the Bara. I recently got tested for the Bar it was $750.00 which was cheap for test that lasted about 6 hours. Good Luck
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