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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by daizy on February 20, 2003, at 11:26:04
In reply to Re: My Effexor experience -- another nasty drug » daizy, posted by rickj on February 19, 2003, at 14:06:22
> Thanx Daizy for your thoughts. I'd never posted to a bulletin board before... So are you off effexor and now doing therapy? And you find it helps?
>
> You're right, my body (and head) just didn't want more chemicals. I also felt like the effexor was trying to take over -- all those weird sensations everywhere. Maybe I did too many drugs before... And you're right on the money: it's physically like E, only without the euphoria and energy. Funny that you made the same connection. I wonder if the effexor "reminds" the body of E (if you've taken E already), or whether they somehow work in a similar way. Anybody else done both E and Effexor?
>
> A healthy lifestyle seems to get easier with age (I'm now 33). There's only so much self-abuse you can take... I do recommend yoga, especially with a good instructor. I like Ashtanga -- you sweat like crazy, but feel sooo relaxed at the end, calm, and feeling better about things.
>
>
>Yeah Im having therapy(although I havnt been for a while!)
Its helped me to clarify and make sense of things that have happened to me. think you should try.
I think your right about the effexor, have you stopped it totally? and you feel better for it? If so then you made the right decision!
Posted by daizy on February 20, 2003, at 11:28:10
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal, posted by Chris314 on February 20, 2003, at 10:26:44
>Try halving a 37.5 for two or three days, then quartering for a few days.
Posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 12:07:00
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal --- tina p , posted by keroppi on February 18, 2003, at 14:50:20
Is enyone having a problem with blurred vission?
I've been taking Effexor for 3 weeks. I started with 37.5mg's for a week and for the past two weeks I've been taking 75mg's. I'm no longer feeling depressed and feel the anxiety has lessoned. But I feel tired all the time, I don't seem to be concentrating as well, I yawn a lot, break it in sweats, but what I'm must worried about is the blurred vision. Do these side effects go away. I need some energy, I work full time, go to school and have 3 children.
I tried prozac, paxil, and welbutrin, but I had major weight gain.
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 13:17:48
In reply to blurred vission » keroppi, posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 12:07:00
I've experienced the blurred vision with my other medication (xoloft and prozac) but less with efferox. One side effect recently came to light. I'm a frequent blood donor. However, I can never donate blood again. Efferox has raised my liver enzymes to a level that is unacceptable by the FDA for donors. Has anyone else experienced this? When I was first put on the medication, my PCP thought I had heptitatus. What an ass! He scared the living daylights out of me. So, I get a handle on my depression but then my liver it shot? I've been suffering from depression for 9 years and only in the last 3 years have I sought help. Now, maybe it's easier for me not to have sought help. At least I'd know when I die, my organs will be clean to donate.
Posted by jtc on February 20, 2003, at 13:53:19
In reply to Efferox side effects, posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 13:17:48
> I've experienced the blurred vision with my other medication (xoloft and prozac) but less with efferox. One side effect recently came to light. I'm a frequent blood donor. However, I can never donate blood again. Efferox has raised my liver enzymes to a level that is unacceptable by the FDA for donors. Has anyone else experienced this? When I was first put on the medication, my PCP thought I had heptitatus. What an ass! He scared the living daylights out of me. So, I get a handle on my depression but then my liver it shot? I've been suffering from depression for 9 years and only in the last 3 years have I sought help. Now, maybe it's easier for me not to have sought help. At least I'd know when I die, my organs will be clean to donate.
That is really scary about the liver enzymes. I wonder if I should get a liver enzymes test also. I think I am going to try to go off of Effexor XR. I am on 75 mg and it is no longer helping me and I don't want to increase to 150 mg because I used to take 150 and didn't like that either. What do you think? By the way I also have vision problems on effexor and concentration problems and memory problems.
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 13:56:38
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by jtc on February 20, 2003, at 13:53:19
I've experienced the "senior moments" and it's really taking a toll on me because I've always had good memory. You should talk to your PCP about getting a blood test done and also talk to your doctor who's prescribing your meds. I have an appointment to see my doctor in a few weeks. I don't really want to stop taking efferox because it's the only med that's really helped me and I've been feeling really good since I've been on it. I don't want to revert back to the way I was before.
Posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 14:19:59
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 13:56:38
I've read that there's the possibility of liver damage with Effexor. But you don't know how much of what you read on the internet is true. I know what you mean about not wanting to take meds. I've tried several times to go without, but find within a year I need something again. I have an appointment with my doctor next week I'm going to ask him about my side effects. Have you tried to go off Effexor? I hope it's not as auful as it sounds.
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 14:24:29
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 14:19:59
I haven't tried to go off of Efferox because I'm really scared of what might happen. Besides being depressed I also have suicidal tendencies and I'm what they call a "cutter." But I haven't done any of those things since I've been on the meds. There are days that I don't take my meds and I'll be fine. But if I go too long with it, I can tell something is wrong. The most I've gone without my meds is 2 days. I'm at 150 mg which is working good for me. My doctor orginially wanted me to go up to 225mg (that's three pills).
Posted by keroppi on February 20, 2003, at 15:04:43
In reply to Efferox side effects, posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 13:17:48
I was worried about my liver too, because I've been on so many antidepressants, which are all metabolized in the liver. Plus, I used to drink ALOT, even when I was on the meds. So I went in for a physical and had my liver tested. Luckily, it came back normal. I would encourage anybody who is concerned about this to get their liver tested.
Posted by jtc on February 20, 2003, at 19:42:58
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 14:19:59
> I've read that there's the possibility of liver damage with Effexor. But you don't know how much of what you read on the internet is true. I know what you mean about not wanting to take meds. I've tried several times to go without, but find within a year I need something again. I have an appointment with my doctor next week I'm going to ask him about my side effects. Have you tried to go off Effexor? I hope it's not as auful as it sounds.
>
> I haven't tried to go off Effexor yet. I don't know how I will handle it though. I sort of dread it. I have panic disorder and anxiety and depression so I am certain I will need some medication again after going off Effexor (if I can go off it). I have tried Luvox (it helped me), also have tried Prozac, Celexa, Zoloft, and Paxil. So I don't know what else to try if I can get off Effexor. Any suggestions? Thanks...
Posted by MsX on February 20, 2003, at 21:52:50
In reply to blurred vission » keroppi, posted by napaba on February 20, 2003, at 12:07:00
> Is enyone having a problem with blurred vission?
>
> I've been taking Effexor for 3 weeks. I started with 37.5mg's for a week and for the past two weeks I've been taking 75mg's. I'm no longer feeling depressed and feel the anxiety has lessoned. But I feel tired all the time, I don't seem to be concentrating as well, I yawn a lot, break it in sweats, but what I'm must worried about is the blurred vision. Do these side effects go away. I need some energy, I work full time, go to school and have 3 children.
>
> I tried prozac, paxil, and welbutrin, but I had major weight gain.
I've had a major problem with no energy and being tired all the time, dizziness, weird blurred vision, etc. Same stuff as you, and in my experience it has just worsened over time. I'm now weaning off Effexor and it is every bit as awful as others have said. I've slowed down the time schedule as far as how much I reduce taking and that seems to help. Been weaning off for about 2 weeks now and probably have at least another week or two to go. Then no more!!! Good luck
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 21:57:17
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by jtc on February 20, 2003, at 19:42:58
Don't dread it. I don't think there's an immediate affect on the liver. After I've asked my doctor and I'll what she tells me. :o)
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 22:08:18
In reply to Re: blurred vission, posted by MsX on February 20, 2003, at 21:52:50
Are you going to start another anti-depressant or are you completely going off the medication?
Posted by Tina P on February 21, 2003, at 8:20:38
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal, posted by Chris314 on February 20, 2003, at 10:26:44
chris, just want you to know that Welbutrin had me very sick, vomiting after a few days from such horrible dizziness and headaches, be careful!
Posted by rickj on February 21, 2003, at 10:06:28
In reply to Re: Scared of Effexor, posted by jtc on February 18, 2003, at 21:54:18
In general, there are at least four big problems with mind-altering drugs (including prescription, "legitimate" pills.) 1) Dependency; 2) Tolerance; 3) Side effects; 4) Long-term consequences. I'd be worried about Effexor on all four counts.
Dependency: It's easy to start relying on any drug that makes you feel better, especially if the alternative seems unacceptably bleak. Worse, Effexor is clearly addictive. Very many people seem to suffer from withdrawal symptoms, in some cases of such severity that they are unable to kick the drug. In fact, missing just one dose seems sufficient to activate withdrawal (as opposed to a recurrence of the original problem.) This is clear evidence of addiction.
Tolerance: Inevitably, your body builds up resistance to any given drug. So you start off at 37.5 g, then it's 75, soon 150 g, then 225 g. In large quantities, the risks from any drug increase accordingly.
Side effects: Nearly every drug is accompanied by some kind of side effect. Effexor's seem pretty severe, ranging from tiredness and difficulties concentrating to sexual dysfunction, constipation, headaches and liver problems.
Long-term consequences: Over the years, there have been many scary postings on this bulletin board from long-term (even medium-term) consumers of Effexor who are deeply troubled by what it has done to them. Some are now suing the manufacturer.
Effexor (and maybe other anti-depressants too) is especially problematic. It's being consumed by people who are, by definition, not in great mental health, and may even be desperate and suicidal. They are given a powerful, addictive drug that is legally and socially legitimated by the doctor's prescription. This drug quickly alters your mind and body. By the time you've finished the two-week "starter kit" (and you're told to persevere, to give it a chance to work) you are probably already addicted. Soon you're drugged up, less able to think rationally or objectively and understand what it's doing to you. Meanwhile, you're slowly building up tolerance and therefore requiring larger and larger doses (= more and more money for the manufacturer), while the drug wreaks changes that are foreshadowed by unpleasant "side effects" but whose severity may only become apparent once you finally succeed in quitting the stuff.
As an adult, it's completely up to each of us to decide whether the benefits of Effexor outweigh the negatives, and whether to continue. But an 8-year-old lacks the self-awareness and maturity to make that kind of call. This is a hardcore drug. A young person's mind and personality are still growing. This drug may really mess her up.If I may rant a little, I think your psychiatrist is ill-informed or irresponsible (or self-intere$ted) to have prescribed it to a child in the first place. He or she should try a two-week dose themselves...
I'm not trying to be preachy. Mental problems are no fun. We all do what we can. But I was struck by how the fact of a legal prescription for Effexor gives the stuff a patina of respectability and "normalcy" that I don't think it deserves at all.
Sorry for such a long posting, and the best of luck.
> Hi, I have been on Effexor XR, 75 mg for about 10 months. Before the Effexor I took Luvox for about 2 years. I have generalized anxiety and panic disorder and also depression. I find that the Effexor is no longer making me feel better. I am very irritable and short with my kids and I just don't feel well. I talked to my psychiatrist and told him I didn't think effexor was helping me anymore but he told me to increase to 150 mg a day for two weeks until my appointment with him. I am scared to increase it because I would really like to go off Effexor. My 8 year old daughter has also been taking Effexor XR 37.5 mg for about four months. It seems to be helping her with her anxiety. She is doing better in school but she is more aggressive and talks mean to me and her 4 year old sister. Her doctor says to let her take the Effexor until school is out for the summer. AFter reading the posts on this message board I am getting really worried for my daughter to be taking this medication. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much, jc
Posted by daizy on February 21, 2003, at 10:14:36
In reply to Re: My Effexor experience -- another nasty drug » rickj, posted by daizy on February 20, 2003, at 11:26:04
mdma.net, has research you might like to see.
Posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:20:36
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by keroppi on February 20, 2003, at 15:04:43
What is involved in having your liver tested?
Posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:28:24
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by jtc on February 20, 2003, at 19:42:58
> > I've read that there's the possibility of liver damage with Effexor. But you don't know how much of what you read on the internet is true. I know what you mean about not wanting to take meds. I've tried several times to go without, but find within a year I need something again. I have an appointment with my doctor next week I'm going to ask him about my side effects. Have you tried to go off Effexor? I hope it's not as auful as it sounds.
> >
> > I haven't tried to go off Effexor yet. I don't know how I will handle it though. I sort of dread it. I have panic disorder and anxiety and depression so I am certain I will need some medication again after going off Effexor (if I can go off it). I have tried Luvox (it helped me), also have tried Prozac, Celexa, Zoloft, and Paxil. So I don't know what else to try if I can get off Effexor. Any suggestions? Thanks...I've been on Prozac, Paxil and welbutrin. I didn't like how Prozac and paxil made me feel. Welbutrin seems to be the mildest and didn't help at all. But I was only taking two a day. (when I remembered)It's hard for me to remember to take a pill once a day let alone two times.
I really don't have any suggestions. I know someone who takes Serzone and says it's the best one she's ever taken. But I don't know what the side effects are.
>
>
Posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:33:59
In reply to Re: blurred vission, posted by Asyan Delight on February 20, 2003, at 22:08:18
> Are you going to start another anti-depressant or are you completely going off the medication?
When I'm not taking an anti-depressant thoughts of Suicide are frequent, so I think I need to take something. Talking to a physicologist I couldn't stand. The ones I went to blamed everything on my childhood. I really feel I deal quite well those issues. I guessd I just don't know. Everything has a side effect including doing nothing.
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 21, 2003, at 11:22:42
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:20:36
Just go to your PCP (Primary Care Physician) and tell them that you'd like some blood work done, especially blood work dealing with your liver (ie. hepatitus tests).
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 21, 2003, at 11:24:33
In reply to Re: Efferox side effects, posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:28:24
Prozac didn't help me either. It made me really maniac!!! I was out of control. Singing on the overhead paging system at work. Driving crazy on the freeway. Let's just say I was more daring. :o)
Posted by Asyan Delight on February 21, 2003, at 11:26:41
In reply to Re: blurred vission, posted by napaba on February 21, 2003, at 10:33:59
best of luck in whatever you decide to you - losing your life to this illness is letting it win. I wish there were permanent things they can do to alter the chemicals in our brains so we don't think this way.
Posted by HannahBeGood on February 23, 2003, at 22:10:21
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawal Geoff , Keroppi, posted by Katia on February 19, 2003, at 15:43:34
> I was on Effexor (Eff.) for about four months. It helped with my depression, but I too was constipated for awhile, then I slept for hours, couldn't wake up before noon (luckily I work in the evening). After about two months, I started experiencing those heart palpitations, electrical shocks, brain not connecting as fast as my movements, spaciness, etc. The thing about all those symptons is, I didn't realize it for awhile. I didn't realize that I was spacey because I was so spacey!! It's a confusing feeling. I''m also in grad school, which makes it hard.
> Today has been a week totally off Eff. and it hasn't been easy. I did the tapering and I still have headahces, MOODINESS, electrical shocks, my body just feels wrecked.
> Glad to hear it works for you. I'm transitioning onto Zoloft. Anyone with experiences/doses?
> Thanks.
> Katia
>> > People tell me please...
> > I am a sufferer of clinical depression, and I have found that anti-depressant drugs relieve my misery miraculously. I would never, EVER want to stop taking my Effexor and go back to the sadness I was living with. So, why are so many of you doing this, and struggling with these awful side affects? I guess I have no concept of why anyone would want to stop taking this drug when it is so helpful to me and has improved my quality of life so much. Would some of you please share your scenarios with me so I have a better understanding, and perhaps I can be better prepared for the possibilty of having to give up this drug in my future? (snipped)Tina P~
Speaking for myself, yes, FXR, with the addition of dexedrine, did help me move through and out of a period of uncontrollable grief and major clinical depression. I was on it (up to 300 mgs.) for 9 mos. However, it puts me to sleep and I have a life-long problem with excessive daytime sleepiness (& ADD, recently diagnosed). Even on 80 mgs. of dexedrine, and up to 120 mgs of Adderall, I cd. not function adequately on FXR due to the 'sleepy' side effect-it made me fuzzy, and tended to flatten my emotional responses to too great a degree, once I had passed thru the critical grief-healing period.
I actually needed DE-sensitization in the beginning, but, once I came to grips w/ my losses, I had to, slowly, step out of my cozy FXR cocoon. I could feel happiness and interest in life again, I was no longer perpetually sad & grief-stricken, but my pleasant interior 'mental' and emotional change, did not make me much more functional in the practical, physical sense. Because I had no energy. Effexor is a strong, effective drug for many (and I am very treatment resistant) but if even the smallest dose knocks me out, I cannot glean its benefits due to this side-effect. One must be awake to function!And, to you, Tina, and *Katia*-AND ALL those who will or are trying to stop Effexor---I did it and I did not SUFFER
at all.Lexapro was just out, my p-doc gave me lots of samples, he & I discussed dropping the FXR slowly, which, to him wd. take perhaps 2-3 weeks, b/c he has great confidence in Lex. I told him, if I exp'd any discomfort, I wd. go as slowly as necessary to control any WD symptoms. It took me about 2 months too completely stop the FXR.(I started Lex at the same time, but started w/5mgs daily a7 moved up to 10 within 2 weeks). My p-doc gave me one starter sample pack of FXR to taper with, since they had the lower dosage caplets. UI also still had about 450 mgs. at home. I dropped slowly, say 20 -30 mgs a week, and sometimes wd. skip a dose, then,(and this usually happened within 30 hrs.) when I HAD THE SMALLEST BRAIN 'SWOOSH' (sorry, caps)or any seemingly WD related dysthymia, I immediately took perhaps half a 37.5. And 99% of the time, I was ok within an hour. During the second month I took 8-15 granules of FXR daily or every other day, and, later in the month, I began to skip days, taking a few granules only if I had a 'swoosh'.
After about 11 weeks I began to forget to take the granules as the intermittent swooshes finally stopped and my Effexor experiences (I had tried it once before 3 yrs. ago, but w/o the stims, was simply comatose) are now a very important component of my psychiatric history.
Katia, from what dosage, and how long did you give yourself to titrate down and off the FXR? In your place, I wd. take juat 15 granules of FXR and see if it helped alleviate the WD symptoms you are still feeling. If this does not help, try another 15 granules, say 2 hrs. later. It sounds like you titrated down too quickly for YOU and may need to add a small amt. of FXR back (along w/your Zoloft) until you are no longer feeling ill, and then titrate as slowly as you must to avoid the discomforts of withdrtawal. I have used Zoloft, but with no effect, so I cannot helpyou there. Are you discussing all this with a therapist? What are his/her insights, recommendations, and what is your diagnosis?
Please let me (us) know how it goes. There is no excuse for suffering to such a degree, when it CAN be avoided with the proper, individualized titration schedule.
So, please note:
*Titrate all drugs (up or down) to minimize and possibly avoid side-effects. And do it as slowly as you individually require.
*If you suffer from anxiety or insomnia during med changes, use something to help you over the 'hump'. Even benadryl or peppermint tea for stomach upset sometimes is enuf to help you through the transition. But, your dr. must help you during transitions, even if that means temporarily treating you with a stop-gap med.
*If your dr. does not believe in how radically side-effects affect drug compliance and follow-through, do some research on the google search engine or in Dr. Bob's tips. Print this info out and take it w/you to your doc.
If a trial medication causes you immediate debilitating discomfort or illness, say upon *first dose or during first day*, call your doc immediately with this urgent info. If I began vomiting, had severe chest or head pain,elevated blood pressure, fainted, felt manic or, sudden deep dysphoria, I wd. take no more of the med until I had immmediate input from a professional. I wd. also call a friend or relative to be with me until I knew which way was up.Some meds actually do make us sicker. But, get prof'l guidance in any situation like this. Don't just uit and believe that all is safe.
All of this is just my opinion and what I have learned from research, Dr. Bob's site, and my own experience. I am not a doc, but I do believe in reading and reseaching all you can on your own symptoms, possible diagnoses, family history (including drinking, gambling, substance use, pronounced moodiness, learning disabilities,
intelligent relatives who were low achievers, those w/quick tempers or a tendency towards bouts of 'rage')not to mention all the common disorders---all can be significant and help provide a backdrop for a you and a therapist to help compose a more intricate and revealing portrait of what your obstacles are and how best to treat them. This helps provide for more accurate prescibing, I think, as well.The more you know, the more you will understand when your doc prescibes a particular med or therapy. If you don't understand, ask him why? Write down any and all ?'s before your appt. and try not to feel intimidated.
Hope This helps either/both of you. Tina, glad the FXR is working for you and with the use of ration and good sense, you need not fear the discontinuation nightmares that tend to surface due to overly-rapid cessation of FXR and many other drugs.All things in moderation~Hannah
Posted by LA on February 24, 2003, at 11:26:11
In reply to Re: Effexor W'drawalTina /Katia:painlessIFpatient, posted by HannahBeGood on February 23, 2003, at 22:10:21
Today is my second day off effexor.
In 2 weeks I went from 300 to 37.5 (as per my doctor ). I did not feel bad until 2 days ago when I hit 0. I am now crying all the time, even over thinking of experiences, that I thought I had dealt with. I feel dizzy and naueous and tired with a slight headache. The only time I seem to feel better is when I am eating and as soon as I stop eating I feel even worse. This is besides the fact that I don't need to eat with 30 pound increase in weight.
I am on my way to the doctors.
Posted by catri on February 24, 2003, at 11:55:09
In reply to Re: Effexor Withdrawl, posted by LA on February 24, 2003, at 11:26:11
Hello, all.
Good luck LA with the withdrawal! Tell us what the doc has to say about the withdrawal side effects - I have not yet come off Effexor XR (75mg) but when I do, I think that this site will have help me loads!! I am, unfortunately, in any position to give it up yet - its made am amazing difference to my life. Anyway I am going on a holiday to the states soon (I live in the UK) and I was wondering what peoples' experiences were of flying long haul whilst on the drug? Do you get vertigo or nauseous?? Normally I don't experience any motion sickeness, but previously on Prozac I didn't travel very well at all. Any feedback would be helpful....
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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