![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 0:21:41
If you like the advice and research I give, thank God and His representative on Earth, the Salvation Army Southern California Division (Adult Rehabilitation Center Command).
Wherever the Salvation Army serves, it's a shining example of Faith in Action. As an expression of its spiritual beliefs, the Army offers humanitarian services. It has 9,600 Centers, 5,500 Officers, 38,000 SOLDIERS (Real Men Wear Blue)--like me-- in the United States. It provides:
PHYSICAL AID - food, clothing, and shelter, in an atmosphere of dignity and respect.
SPECIAL ASSISTANCE - help in facing personal problems. The Army works to improve family relationships and deal with the problems of single parents, alcoholics, drug abusers, ex-prisoners, and others.
REHABILITATION CENTERS - in residence programs that provide work, emotional therapy and conseling. The Army also provides drug and alcohol rehabilitation programs.
*****
Blood
&
Fire - Support the Salvation Army:
1865-2001 and forever!
Posted by kazoo on August 27, 2001, at 1:48:18
In reply to Sal(vation) Army 4 Me, posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 0:21:41
> SPECIAL ASSISTANCE - help in facing personal problems. The Army works to improve family relationships and deal with the problems of single parents, alcoholics, drug abusers, ex-prisoners, and others.
^^^^^^^^^^^^"...and others"?
So what's this all about:
http://www.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/07/10/bush.salvationarmy/index.html
The Salvation Army is a good organization, there's no doubt about this, and perhaps George W. and family could gain some useful insight into their own DRUG and ALCOHOL preferences.
kazoo
Posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:07:03
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by kazoo on August 27, 2001, at 1:48:18
Inspired by the authority of the GENERAL:
The Salvation Army believes that the Old and New Testaments are the perfect Word of God, and the only basis for Christian faith and practice. Thus, the hiring of homosexuals, as they are condemned by the Holy Bible, shall not be tolerated by the Salvation Army. But, all homosexuals are to be treated with the utmost dignity, keeping in mind that as an inheritance from our first fathers, all men were made sinners--homosexuals included. But all have the capacity to accept the Lord Jesus Christ as savior, and thus homosexuals may serve the Church in some of the capacities that other unsaved persons do.
Only those who comply with the spirit of God's holy will may become SOLDIERS; Only those who have been saved and then called to lifetime effective service can become OFFICERS; and only those who can abide by the 11 Doctrines of the Salvation Army can become EMPLOYEES.
May God bless His General....Jason T., SOLDIER
Posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:24:27
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » kazoo, posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:07:03
Sal - Just how is homosexuality a sin and why would someone who is homosexual be unsaved? Can't the stigma associated with homosexuals in our society be likened to the stigma associated with mental illness?
If sexual orientation and being "saved" is a requirement to get into heaven, count me out. The far more interesting and informative people must be somewhere else.
Hanging with the atheists, agnostics, human secularists, Hindus, Muslims, Buddists, et al - Cam
BTW - Shouldn't this be on PSB?
Posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:31:01
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:24:27
...secular humanists (hey, it's late). - Cam
> Hanging with the atheists, agnostics, ••human secularists••, Hindus, Muslims, Buddists, et al
Posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:38:00
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:24:27
I serve with some "gay" soldiers-- guys who have been in homosexuality all their lives. They can live as "gay" and still keep their homosexual subculture, but they cannot perform acts of sex with members of the same sex and still remain officers, soldiers, or employees of the Salvation Army. Likewise, men and women cannot perform acts of sex unless married by God.
I didn't make these rules, we believe that God did. And His Holy General is commissioned to enforce the rules, but we all must _pray_ for those who will not be saved.
J.T., SOLDIER
Salvation Army Southern California Division.
Lt. Colonel Alfred R. Van Cleef, DIVISIONAL COMMANDER.
Posted by Thrud on August 27, 2001, at 3:16:12
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » Cam W., posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:38:00
> I serve with some "gay" soldiers-- guys who have been in homosexuality all their lives. They can live as "gay" and still keep their homosexual subculture, but they cannot perform acts of sex with members of the same sex and still remain officers, soldiers, or employees of the Salvation Army.
I can't perform sex with members of the opposite sex because of these fucking medications!!!!!
I guess I can't be a soldier either? ;) Ah well, not the first time: I was rejected from the Army Reserve because of my poor eyesight.Yours in neverending battles.
Thrud
Posted by JohnL on August 27, 2001, at 3:55:51
In reply to Sal(vation) Army 4 Me, posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 0:21:41
I live one block away from a Salvation Army amplitheater, where every summer they have concerts, orchestras, and many religious guest speakers. The music fills the air in the neighborhood and it is pretty cool. I know it sounds weird, but you can actually feel the goodness in the air.All too often I think we tend to focus on this lifetime as being the main thing, whereas in actuality it is probably just a minor blip on the radar screen of a much larger picture.
But even a short blip on the radar screen can be pure nightmare without good religious foundation, and in our cases here at this board, good and proper medications. I can honestly say God rescued me in my worst times and gave me strength to go on. No cure, but stength. He later provided the cure through correct medication. I am continually in awe at His awesome power and mysterious ways which are many times just too profound for our tiny brains to comprehend. I guess that's why it is all about faith. We tend to think too scientifically sometimes, and accidentally rule out things that over ride science.
I'm just rambling, and this thread probably is in the wrong board, but I just wanted to say I respect the Salvation Army a lot.
John
Posted by Simcha on August 27, 2001, at 7:32:49
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » Cam W., posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:38:00
Sal,
This is a room for advice about medications. If you have another agenda like recruiting or converting go somewhere else. I take offense at this statement:
>I serve with some "gay" soldiers-- guys who have been in homosexuality all their lives. They can live as "gay" and still keep their homosexual subculture, but they cannot perform acts of sex with members of the same sex and still remain officers, soldiers, or employees of the Salvation Army. Likewise, men and women cannot perform acts of sex unless married by God.
This a load of cr*p. The Salvation Army or any other religious group should not receive federal funding just because of this. The Salvation Army does a lot of good. Yet it is a private and religious affair. The government is to remain neutral in religious affairs.
I am gay and Jewish. I do not want the government giving any funds to any Jewish organizations. I do not want Big Brother to have a say on what my religious organizations can or can't do. Thus the government has no business supporting any religious organizations.
Sal, save your preaching for someone else. I am a Jew. We do not believe in Hell or in Jesus. I do not care that you call me "unsaved." I know that G-d, Adonai, the G-d of my ancestors Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Sarah, Rachel, Rebecca, and Leah will call me home when the time is right.
Whatever you believe is G-d's truth for you. Save the pamphlets. Save the "fire and brimstone." G-d gave you a different way to know G-d. This is your way especially revealed for you. All we ask is that you respect the ways in which G-d has manifested G-d's self in our lives.
> I serve with some "gay" soldiers-- guys who have been in homosexuality all their lives. They can live as "gay" and still keep their homosexual subculture, but they cannot perform acts of sex with members of the same sex and still remain officers, soldiers, or employees of the Salvation Army. Likewise, men and women cannot perform acts of sex unless married by God.
>
> I didn't make these rules, we believe that God did. And His Holy General is commissioned to enforce the rules, but we all must _pray_ for those who will not be saved.
>
> J.T., SOLDIER
> Salvation Army Southern California Division.
> Lt. Colonel Alfred R. Van Cleef, DIVISIONAL COMMANDER.
Posted by JahL on August 27, 2001, at 9:32:30
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:24:27
> If sexual orientation and being "saved" is a requirement to get into heaven, count me out. The far more interesting and informative people must be somewhere else.Cam; I'm with you on this one ;-)
I'm also uneasy about religious organisations trying to recruit people who are at their most vunerable. People who might confuse hope with reality.
> Hanging with the atheists, agnostics, human secularists, Hindus, Muslims, Buddists, et al - CamAren't Muslims rabidly 'homophobic' too? I don't pay a lot of attention to organised religion so I could be wrong...
J.
Posted by Phil on August 27, 2001, at 9:45:19
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by Simcha on August 27, 2001, at 7:32:49
Our stories are similar. I was a church goer for a while in the 80's and it gave me comfort. When my meds began working again, I thanked God.
I don't know exactly what my beliefs are these days but that's neither here nor there.
I absolutely do not believe that being gay closes the door to the kingdom. I DO believe, as the wonderful writer C.S. Lewis wrote in Mere Christianity, that the absolute worst sin in God's eyes is pride. Unhealthy pride. Example: Someone who attends church but looks down on those that don't is at complete odds with God's message. Sex was not a major concern of Christ's message. He certainly was against pride, greed, and incincerity.Thinkin out loud.
Phil
ps..Always liked this guote by Alfred-Lord TennysonThe great God looked down and smiled and counted each His loving child, for monk and Brahmin, Turk or Jew, loved Him through the Gods they knew.
Posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 10:43:29
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » Cam W., posted by JahL on August 27, 2001, at 9:32:30
Jah - I wrote that blurb in the middle of the night. I even have trouble keeping my Orthodoxes and Fundamentalists straight, at the best of times.. Seems to me that I may not hang with Muslims (those are the Taliban guys, aren't they? - scary group).
(a blissfully ignorant) - Cam
Posted by KB on August 27, 2001, at 10:46:35
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » kazoo, posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:07:03
Sal, I am a lesbian and I come to this board looking for support with my depression. I do NOT feel supported by statements about how the bible condemns homosexuality.
Posted by pellmell on August 27, 2001, at 11:24:18
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » Cam W., posted by JahL on August 27, 2001, at 9:32:30
>
> > If sexual orientation and being "saved" is a requirement to get into heaven, count me out. The far more interesting and informative people must be somewhere else.
>
> Cam; I'm with you on this one ;-)
>
> I'm also uneasy about religious organisations trying to recruit people who are at their most vunerable. People who might confuse hope with reality.
>
Me too. Although I wouldn't imply that I've got a firm grip on this "reality" thing (an uncertainty carefully cultivated through a postmodern education in English lit ;)). So I'm not so afraid that people drawn into conservative incarnations of religion will blinded to The Truth About Reality (the "real world," atoms and forces, etc.), because I don't think we can be productive sentient beings without illusions. I'm afraid that the illusions that conservative religions supply promote (and often *require*) a turning away from self-knowledge and what feels true and compassionate. Also, containing oneself in a strict religious structure can lead to a spiral of self-loathing, especially when it tries to deny our fundamental biology. (The human race would've died out a long time ago if it weren't for lustful thoughts. ;)) Striving to "be like Jesus" is setting yourself up for constant failure. We can't take constant failure without breaking down, so we create even more desperate illusions that distance us from ourselves. Conservative religion is superb training in the denial of negative evidence; I think that's part of why we here in the USA can keep believing that global warming, for example, doesn't exist.To balance this, I think Jesus was probably a amazingly compassionate, charismatic person. We can't know what exactly he was all about, but he almost certainly wasn't a big fan of violent conflict. So what's with all this military jargon in conservative religous organizations like The Salvation Army??
> > Hanging with the atheists, agnostics, human secularists, Hindus, Muslims, Buddists, et al - Cam
>
> Aren't Muslims rabidly 'homophobic' too? I don't pay a lot of attention to organised religion so I could be wrong...
>
Yep, but we've been there already. :)Hey, and don't forget the Unitarian Universalists (my particular religious subscription).
-pm
Posted by Jane D on August 27, 2001, at 11:44:28
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me, posted by KB on August 27, 2001, at 10:46:35
To All,
Sal started off only by explaining what motivates him to participate in this board. I'm sure we all have beliefs, some of them religious, which shape the responses we make on this board. Every time you take the time to comfort someone you are probably calling on some of those beliefs. Mine are rooted very deeply in atheism.
I too disagree with the Salvation Army's stance on homosexuality (and much else) but Sal got suckered into that discussion. As other people claimed, it was late so give him a break. And Sal, if you're still reading, please drop it!
Sal has a right to tell us what motivates him. That seems like a reasonable topic (and on this board since this is about why he posts about drugs). What doesn't belong here is an in depth discussion of the doctrine of the Salvation Army.
It also seems to me that any time you judge a religion by the harm done in its name you need to look at the good too. And that is going to include any good acts performed by people acting in the name of that religion. It's one of the things that has always confused me - just how to deal with religions I detest that contain good people doing good things in the name of that religion.
Jane
Posted by chloe on August 27, 2001, at 12:14:18
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » kazoo, posted by SalArmy4me on August 27, 2001, at 2:07:03
I feel that posts like these and others completely unrelated to the topic DO NOT deserve a response. However, this time I just couldn't keep my fingers still.
I thought this was a board about medications and medication related issues. I am beyond dissappointed that people, (especially someone who knows better, Sal) feel free to air their religious beliefs here. I am also put off by misguided pitches to get us all away from the evils of perscription medicines. At one time, this board was filled with useful and supportive information. But now I see PB is becoming a place for folks with narcissistic and self serving agendas.
Just for today (and maybe a lot longer!) I say I have had enough of this board and it's preachings...
Secularly,
Chloe
Posted by Phil on August 27, 2001, at 12:32:11
In reply to Re: What is PB turning in to???, posted by chloe on August 27, 2001, at 12:14:18
Posted by Krazy Kat on August 27, 2001, at 12:44:46
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me John, posted by Phil on August 27, 2001, at 9:45:19
That's really nice, Phil...
Krazy Kat (Was Kingfish, but Ignatz came to the board and won me over ;) ).
Posted by Krazy Kat on August 27, 2001, at 12:48:58
In reply to Re: Give Sal a break, posted by Jane D on August 27, 2001, at 11:44:28
I agree with Jane, too.
- K-K
Posted by Dr. Bob on August 27, 2001, at 13:52:40
In reply to Re: Sal(vation) Army 4 Me » SalArmy4me, posted by Cam W. on August 27, 2001, at 2:24:27
> BTW - Shouldn't this be on PSB?
Yes, discussion of religion and sexuality should be at Psycho-Social-Babble (and discussion of board policies should be at Psycho-Babble Administration). Thanks,
Bob
This is the end of the thread.
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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