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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 15 to 39 of 39. Go back in thread:
Posted by AndrewB on March 9, 2000, at 14:31:47
In reply to Re: Janet R - fatigue/depression, posted by Karen on March 9, 2000, at 0:08:35
Karen,
Thanks for telling us of this combination, I remember of a previous poster from India who was helped by this same combination. He was an atypical bipolar I think.
Both amineptine and sulpiride act only on dopamine. It is very interesting how dopamine deficiencies, particularly at the D2 receptors, can be involved with fatigue states. It is clear that dopamine active drugs can relieve these fatigue states (They can also relieve depression but that is a different story). For an in depth description of fatigue states such as those associated with CFS, how the D2 receptor is involved, and why dopamine active med.s can bring relief go to www.prys,net/articles/bruno/runninghead.html
Amineptine is a dopamine reuptake blocker. I am fairly certain that it is no longer available in France or elsewhere. The plants that produced it in Mexico and France have ceased production. Sulpiride is a selective D2 presynaptic receptor antagonist. I don’t think it is available in the US but may be ordered with a prescription from Europe and elsewhere. A good substitute for sulpiride is amisulpride, a limbic system selective presynaptic receptor antagonist. It may be ordered from overseas with a prescription. Amisulpiride has been much more thoroughly studied for treating major depression and dysthymia. There is one recent study however that indicates sulpiride is effective for mild to moderate depression.
Karen you are probably trying to find substitute for this combination of amineptine and sulpiride that was so effective for you. You might try seligiline as a substitute for amineptine. At dose of 15mg or less per day it is an MAO-B, blocking the breakdown of dopamine. At higher doses, up to 60mg/day it is an MAO-I with an MAO-B preference. You can also try wellbutrin and stimulants but with these you will get significant norepinephrine action mixed in with the dopamine action, which may or may not be to your liking.I currently take amisulpride. It prevents fatigue and lifts my mood. By the way, I recently ‘re-energized’ it by taking a 4 day holiday from it. Occasional drug holidays may be necessary with certain dopaminergic drugs to maintain optimal effectiveness. I have also just started taking Mirapex (pramipexole) with it with truly wonderful results. Mirapex is a D2-D3 receptor agonist that acts on the striatum and substantia nigra. Mirapex is available in the US. Those of you outside of the US may have similar agonists available such as roxindole. Mirapex has been shown effective in treating depression in two or three studies.
Best wishes for your health,
AndrewB
Posted by Karen on March 9, 2000, at 16:04:48
In reply to Re: Karen, Janet R - fatigue/depression, posted by AndrewB on March 9, 2000, at 14:31:47
Dear Andrew,
Thanks for your input - very informative!
Where are you getting Amisulpride and for how much? Is delivery reliable? Do you think that this one drug could possibly replace the amineptine and sulpiride combo I was on?
Is Seligiline an MAO? Does this mean the special diet?
I was wondering, if Amisulpride is working well for you, why did you recently add Mirapex? What is the advantage of this?
I have been diagnosed as Bipolar II but from what I have read, my symptoms are atypical, like the guy from India who was on the same meds I mentioned. Funny that up until last year, I was living in a third world country, self medicating and doing a better job at staying well than I am now, with professional help here in the States. Hope I can get it right soon. Living has not been easy lately.
Thank you for all your help. Best to you...
Karen
Posted by AndrewB on March 10, 2000, at 1:30:18
In reply to Re: AndrewB - meds, posted by Karen on March 9, 2000, at 16:04:48
> Dear Karen,
>
>
> Where are you getting Amisulpride and for how much? Is delivery reliable? Do you think that this one drug could possibly replace the amineptine and sulpiride combo I was on?
>
I'm getting the amisulpride from Victoria Apotheke which I refer to in the info piece I sent you. The price is about 75 cents a day for a 50mg. dose. More is not necessarily better. Too much and you might start to antagonize the postsynaptic receptor, the opposite effect of what is wanted. Delivery is reliable. If you are able to get it from the Phillipines please let me know. I don't know if this one drug will replace what you had before. I'm more like a CFS/dysthymic, different from you. When I took amineptine I WAS bothered by side effects. You may have to combine amisulpride with another med or two. If amisulpride doesn’t do it alone maybe try combining it with seligiline or wellbutrin for starters.> Is Seligiline an MAO? Does this mean the special diet?
If you take over 15mgs/day of seligiline observe the MAOI dietary restrictions.
>
> I was wondering, if Amisulpride is working well for you, why did you recently add Mirapex? What is the advantage of this?
>
I ordered Mirapex because amisulpride had partially pooped out. But the 4 day drug holiday reinvigorated my amisulpride. I am taking the Mirapex anyway to see if I can get further benefit (more D2 activation). By the way I also take reboxetine for norepinephrine.> I have been diagnosed as Bipolar II but from what I have read, my symptoms are atypical, like the guy from India who was on the same meds I mentioned. Funny that up until last year, I was living in a third world country, self medicating and doing a better job at staying well than I am now, with professional help here in the States. Hope I can get it right soon. Living has not been easy lately.
>
Strangely in some ways it can be more difficult getting dopamine ADs in the US due to medicine availability and doctors attitudes. Anyway make sure when choosing a psych. to ask first if he would be willing to prescribe the med.s I've listed and if he would be willing to prescribe an overseas med.
Best wishes,AndrewB
Posted by michael on March 10, 2000, at 17:54:15
In reply to Re: Karen, Janet R - fatigue/depression, posted by AndrewB on March 9, 2000, at 14:31:47
> Karen,
>
> Thanks for telling us of this combination, I remember of a previous poster from India who was helped by this same combination. He was an atypical bipolar I think.
>
> Both amineptine and sulpiride act only on dopamine. It is very interesting how dopamine deficiencies, particularly at the D2 receptors, can be involved with fatigue states. It is clear that dopamine active drugs can relieve these fatigue states (They can also relieve depression but that is a different story). For an in depth description of fatigue states such as those associated with CFS, how the D2 receptor is involved, and why dopamine active med.s can bring relief go to www.prys,net/articles/bruno/runninghead.html
>
> Amineptine is a dopamine reuptake blocker. I am fairly certain that it is no longer available in France or elsewhere. The plants that produced it in Mexico and France have ceased production. Sulpiride is a selective D2 presynaptic receptor antagonist. I don’t think it is available in the US but may be ordered with a prescription from Europe and elsewhere. A good substitute for sulpiride is amisulpride, a limbic system selective presynaptic receptor antagonist. It may be ordered from overseas with a prescription. Amisulpiride has been much more thoroughly studied for treating major depression and dysthymia. There is one recent study however that indicates sulpiride is effective for mild to moderate depression.
> Karen you are probably trying to find substitute for this combination of amineptine and sulpiride that was so effective for you. You might try seligiline as a substitute for amineptine. At dose of 15mg or less per day it is an MAO-B, blocking the breakdown of dopamine. At higher doses, up to 60mg/day it is an MAO-I with an MAO-B preference. You can also try wellbutrin and stimulants but with these you will get significant norepinephrine action mixed in with the dopamine action, which may or may not be to your liking.
>
> I currently take amisulpride. It prevents fatigue and lifts my mood. By the way, I recently ‘re-energized’ it by taking a 4 day holiday from it. Occasional drug holidays may be necessary with certain dopaminergic drugs to maintain optimal effectiveness. I have also just started taking Mirapex (pramipexole) with it with truly wonderful results. Mirapex is a D2-D3 receptor agonist that acts on the striatum and substantia nigra. Mirapex is available in the US. Those of you outside of the US may have similar agonists available such as roxindole. Mirapex has been shown effective in treating depression in two or three studies.
>
> Best wishes for your health,
>
> AndrewB
I was just wondering if you had any insights/info regarding amantadine, as an augmenter. I've seen it mentioned in the past with respect to helping to overcome some of the sexual side effects.The reason I'm asking is that I believe it too affects dopamine, and that when it is broken down by the body, a couple of the by-products that result are stimulant-like, giving it a small energizing effect. Just wondering.
Posted by AndrewB on March 11, 2000, at 14:51:34
In reply to Re: Q for Andrew - fatigue/depression, posted by michael on March 10, 2000, at 17:54:34
>
>
> I was just wondering if you had any insights/info regarding amantadine, as an augmenter. I've seen it mentioned in the past with respect to helping to overcome some of the sexual side effects.
>
> The reason I'm asking is that I believe it too affects dopamine, and that when it is broken down by the body, a couple of the by-products that result are stimulant-like, giving it a small energizing effect. Just wondering.
Michael,Amantadine does have dopamine properties (prevents reuptake at the D1 & D2 receptors). It also has serotonergic and noradrenergic activity as well as being an anti-viral and having other activity. It has been speculated to have some antidepressant activity (because it helps with depression associated with borna virus?). Does anyone know of anyone using it for this purpose. It is used by MS patients to combat their fatigue. It is also used to treat apathy asociated with stroke and frontal lobe syndrome. As you said it is used to sounteract SSRI sexual side effects as well as SSRI poop out. Supposedly amantadine has significant side effects so it maybe isn't the the best choice for dealing with D2 receptor based fatigue.
Posted by michael on March 11, 2000, at 17:36:18
In reply to Re: Q for Andrew - Response, posted by AndrewB on March 11, 2000, at 14:51:34
>
> >
> >
> > I was just wondering if you had any insights/info regarding amantadine, as an augmenter. I've seen it mentioned in the past with respect to helping to overcome some of the sexual side effects.
> >
> > The reason I'm asking is that I believe it too affects dopamine, and that when it is broken down by the body, a couple of the by-products that result are stimulant-like, giving it a small energizing effect. Just wondering.
>
>
> Michael,
>
> Amantadine does have dopamine properties (prevents reuptake at the D1 & D2 receptors). It also has serotonergic and noradrenergic activity as well as being an anti-viral and having other activity. It has been speculated to have some antidepressant activity (because it helps with depression associated with borna virus?). Does anyone know of anyone using it for this purpose. It is used by MS patients to combat their fatigue. It is also used to treat apathy asociated with stroke and frontal lobe syndrome. As you said it is used to sounteract SSRI sexual side effects as well as SSRI poop out. Supposedly amantadine has significant side effects so it maybe isn't the the best choice for dealing with D2 receptor based fatigue.*****
Andrew-
Thanks for the reply. By the way, when I referred to the stimulant-like by products of amantadine break down - I was confusing it with Selegline (I got that from the tips section: "it autometabolizes in small amounts to amphetamine and methamphetamine"). Sorry about that one.I don't think I've ever seen anyone here who has actually used amantadine. Rather, I've just seen it either referred to in various literature, or suggested as a possible augmentor (for the sexual side effects) by doc's who have used it successfully w/their patients (from the tips section again).
Posted by Janice on March 12, 2000, at 14:25:44
In reply to Re: Karen - meds, posted by AndrewB on March 10, 2000, at 1:30:18
hi AndrewB,
I am very curious as to what you were doing to manage your symptoms in the third world country.
"Funny that up until last year, I was living in a third world country, self medicating and doing a better job at staying well than I am now, with
professional help here in the States."I feel like a crow who has found a shiny object!
That is, of course, if you have the time and inclination to share that with us.
Thanks, Janice.
Posted by AndrewB on March 12, 2000, at 16:40:22
In reply to Re: AndrewB, posted by Janice on March 12, 2000, at 14:25:44
> hi AndrewB,
>
> I am very curious as to what you were doing to manage your symptoms in the third world country.
>
> "Funny that up until last year, I was living in a third world country, self medicating and doing a better job at staying well than I am now, with
> professional help here in the States."Janice,
It was Karen who said she used to live in a third world country (the Philippines).
Posted by Janice on March 12, 2000, at 22:13:07
In reply to Re: You mean Karen, posted by AndrewB on March 12, 2000, at 16:40:22
Hi Karen,
> >
I am very curious as to what you were doing to manage your symptoms in the third world country.
> >
"Funny that up until last year, I was living in a third world country, self medicating and doing a better job at staying well than I am now, with
professional help here in the States."
>
I'm not certain if you are still on the board, or feel like sharing this with us, but if you do I would appreciate it.Janice
Posted by KarenB on March 13, 2000, at 0:42:40
In reply to Re: Hi Karen (thanks AndrewB), posted by Janice on March 12, 2000, at 22:13:07
Dear Janice,
Hi there!
I lived in the Philippines for five years, and just returned to the States in '99. For over 10 years I had been treated for depression in the States, by various doctors and always with SSRIs, which never worked for me and only added to my frustration. I could not figure out what was wrong with me and was getting very little help. Like, "Oh, that SSRI didn't work? Well, try this one..."
While in the Philippines, I met a very young, just out of med school doctora (female doctor) - a family practitioner, not a psychiatrist. My young children had various illnesses and through my visits to her clinic I got to know her quite well. When I brought up my depression, she suggested that there may be more going on than a unipolar disorder, as she had witnessed a little of my hypomania on occasion and being bipolar herself, knew what she was seeing. She suggested a list of medications I may try and so I did. I worked out my own dosages, based on the inserts and found great success. You see, in the Philippines, everything I wanted to try was available over the counter.
The combo I finally discovered was Survector (amineptine), a modified tricyclic antidepressant which has been since discontinued by the manufacturer - and Dogmatil (sulpiride), a neuroleptic with antidepressant qualities. Both are Dopamine reuptake blockers but I think they work on different receptors. Nothing has ever lifted me, both mind and body, like those two did. And, I may add, NO SIDE EFFECTS! Except, the Dogmatil caused very slight weight gain and no menstrual periods while taking it. I don't mind that side effect at all.
I am still getting the Dogmatil sent to me and am searching other contacts in the islands to buy up leftover stock of the Survector while I can.
I am finding it difficult to find a replacement for these meds here in the US but AndrewB had some suggestions on which I intend to follow up.
Oh, by the way, I am atypical Bipolar II. My depressions are a dark and ugly place combined with unbelievable fatigue. That is where I go without the right meds. After tasting normality for a season, I just don't want to go back there again, you know what I mean? I also have a two year old and almost five year old - both high energy boys. They are a big inspiration to me in staying well. They deserve a whole mommy.
Let me know if you have any other questions, OK?
Karen
Posted by Janice on March 13, 2000, at 23:59:41
In reply to Janice - Medicating in the Philippines, posted by KarenB on March 13, 2000, at 0:42:40
Dear Karen,
How lucky you were to meet this med school doctora and that she was astute enough to recognize your bipolar disorder (& you had the insight to believe her).
Funny that you mention that these medications lifted both your mind and body--I have always noticed this difference also. Some medications lift my body, some my mind...none, both yet.
The best of luck getting these medications you want, or a replacement for them. You sound very proactive. I wish I had been as proactive as I am now, a few years ago because these disorders do steal your life away from you.
Thanks for sharing your story Karen, I find your story inspirational. Janice
Posted by michael on March 21, 2000, at 14:07:53
In reply to Karen- Medicating in the Philippines, posted by Janice on March 13, 2000, at 23:59:41
> Dear Karen,
>
> How lucky you were to meet this med school doctora and that she was astute enough to recognize your bipolar disorder (& you had the insight to believe her).
>
> Funny that you mention that these medications lifted both your mind and body--I have always noticed this difference also. Some medications lift my body, some my mind...none, both yet.
>
> The best of luck getting these medications you want, or a replacement for them. You sound very proactive. I wish I had been as proactive as I am now, a few years ago because these disorders do steal your life away from you.
>
> Thanks for sharing your story Karen, I find your story inspirational. Janice
Karen -Just wondering if you might be able to suggest any sources for sulpiride? Are you still getting it from the Philippines? And is a prescription required? Any luck w/the new meds you were trying?
I'm also curious about the cost (sulpiride) - like you, I doubt it would be covered by insurance. Thanks.
michael
Posted by KarenB on March 21, 2000, at 14:49:39
In reply to Re: Karen- Medicating in the Philippines, posted by michael on March 21, 2000, at 14:07:53
> Karen -
>
> Just wondering if you might be able to suggest any sources for sulpiride? Are you still getting it from the Philippines? And is a prescription required? Any luck w/the new meds you were trying?
>
> I'm also curious about the cost (sulpiride) - like you, I doubt it would be covered by insurance. Thanks.
> michaelMichael,
I had been receiving Sulpiride from my doctora in the Philippines. I would wire the money to her and she in turn would buy the meds and send them to me via DHL shipping. The shipping was $57. for under a kilo weight. The cost was just under 50 cents per capsule and I took two per day, along with the Amineptine.
Ah, the Amineptine... Sigh... If I could still get this combo on a regular basis, I would probably never change. It's so hard to feel good and normal and then to go through this "finding the new meds" routine once again. The weirdness, the depression, the loss of physical energy and well being. However, I know to continue buying up leftover stock of amineptine all over the world is a fool's paradise for me. You know, there will be one very sad day when it's all gone bye-bye and I can't find it anywhere. Then the crash and burn for yours truly...
I am just finishing up my first week on Nortriptyline and I have been depressed the last two days, mentally and physically, thinking bad thoughts about death, etc. I told myself last night that if I was still in the funk when I woke up this morning, I would take one 12.5mg amineptine tablet to jump start my mood & body. I was and I did and it has worked and here I sit at the computer, feeling OK, for now.
I'm feeling a little bit angry today and have a case of "contempt for my illness" going. Ever feel that way? It's like I tell my husband, it ain't easy being me.
If you really want to try the Sulpiride, maybe you could get a script from your own doctor, if they are open to you trying this med as well, and I can ask my doctora if she would be willing to fill the prescription and ship it to you upon receipt of the faxed prescription from your doc? You can e-mail me if you think this is a possibility and I can try to help in any way I can.
Have you considered amisulpiride? There are some interesting points made by AndrewB and I think maybe Scott about this drug within the past week. As someone had suggested, I think it may be a fine solution when paired with a mild stimulant, for "retarded" fatigue-like depression.
I pray wellness for you.
Karen
Posted by Androog on March 12, 2001, at 16:42:58
In reply to Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by Cam W. on March 5, 2000, at 21:31:41
I recently underwent 17 sessions of ECT, my last having taken place over three weeks ago.
Not only am I still depressed, I also don't remember the following:
* My wedding or honeymoon which took place in October 2000
* The names of my nephew, neices and neighbors
* The computer programs I use in my line of work
* Moving out of state and into the house my wife and I currently live in
* Completely re-habbing our kitchen - tearing out all the old tile, re-tiling the floor installing new lighting, sink, dishwasher, garbage disposal, cabinets, etc.
* Any of the movies, books, magazines, etc. I've seen or read in the past year or so
* Most of everything from several YEARS back to the present
My psychiatrist says this is a most unusual response to ECT, and I believe him. But one thing is for sure: I would never undergo another session under any circumstances.I don't say this to try to persuade anyone to abandon the idea of having ECT; I post this simply as a warning you won't hear from the professionals.
I realize my response is atypical, but I can't tell you how difficult it is to live with little recollection of the past.
I can't get a job in my profession until I re-learn the programs I work in. I can't even drive anywhere I used to go without a map from my wife.
And, like I said: I'm still depressed.
So think carefully -- you only have one brain and it stores ALL of your memories.
androog
Posted by steve on March 12, 2001, at 18:20:48
In reply to Re: Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by Androog on March 12, 2001, at 16:42:58
If you have had such brain damage, how do you even know you got ECT?
< /sarcasm > (This means I believe you but am a damn cynic about any BS emanating from the orifices of the researchers who have yet meet a potential revenue source they didn't exalt and extol!
> I recently underwent 17 sessions of ECT, my last having taken place over three weeks ago.
>
> Not only am I still depressed, I also don't remember the following:
>
> * My wedding or honeymoon which took place in October 2000
>
> * The names of my nephew, neices and neighbors
>
> * The computer programs I use in my line of work
>
> * Moving out of state and into the house my wife and I currently live in
>
> * Completely re-habbing our kitchen - tearing out all the old tile, re-tiling the floor installing new lighting, sink, dishwasher, garbage disposal, cabinets, etc.
>
> * Any of the movies, books, magazines, etc. I've seen or read in the past year or so
>
> * Most of everything from several YEARS back to the present
>
> My psychiatrist says this is a most unusual response to ECT, and I believe him. But one thing is for sure: I would never undergo another session under any circumstances.
>
> I don't say this to try to persuade anyone to abandon the idea of having ECT; I post this simply as a warning you won't hear from the professionals.
>
> I realize my response is atypical, but I can't tell you how difficult it is to live with little recollection of the past.
>
> I can't get a job in my profession until I re-learn the programs I work in. I can't even drive anywhere I used to go without a map from my wife.
>
> And, like I said: I'm still depressed.
>
> So think carefully -- you only have one brain and it stores ALL of your memories.
>
> androog
Posted by steve on March 12, 2001, at 20:28:16
In reply to Re: Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by Androog on March 12, 2001, at 16:42:58
On the other hand I know the brother of a guy who got ECTs done while getting his MBA. He didn't have a problem with it, so I guess your mileage may vary.
> I recently underwent 17 sessions of ECT, my last having taken place over three weeks ago.
>
> Not only am I still depressed, I also don't remember the following:
>
> * My wedding or honeymoon which took place in October 2000
>
> * The names of my nephew, neices and neighbors
>
> * The computer programs I use in my line of work
>
> * Moving out of state and into the house my wife and I currently live in
>
> * Completely re-habbing our kitchen - tearing out all the old tile, re-tiling the floor installing new lighting, sink, dishwasher, garbage disposal, cabinets, etc.
>
> * Any of the movies, books, magazines, etc. I've seen or read in the past year or so
>
> * Most of everything from several YEARS back to the present
>
> My psychiatrist says this is a most unusual response to ECT, and I believe him. But one thing is for sure: I would never undergo another session under any circumstances.
>
> I don't say this to try to persuade anyone to abandon the idea of having ECT; I post this simply as a warning you won't hear from the professionals.
>
> I realize my response is atypical, but I can't tell you how difficult it is to live with little recollection of the past.
>
> I can't get a job in my profession until I re-learn the programs I work in. I can't even drive anywhere I used to go without a map from my wife.
>
> And, like I said: I'm still depressed.
>
> So think carefully -- you only have one brain and it stores ALL of your memories.
>
> androog
Posted by quilter on March 13, 2001, at 0:10:58
In reply to Re: Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by Androog on March 12, 2001, at 16:42:58
I had similar results from my ECT series in 1984/5. Won't do that again. The cost is too high. Even now I get surprised by some bit of my past that I no longer remember. It is indeed a very frightening situation to be in. It did seem like it was easier to relearn what was missing than it was to acquire the knowledge in the 1st place. I sure hope that prooves true for you too.
Quilter
Posted by kazoo on March 13, 2001, at 2:17:07
In reply to Re: Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by Androog on March 12, 2001, at 16:42:58
It's a pity you couldn't forget the fact that you had any depression to begin with! Isn't that a basic tenet of ECT? Isn't that what it's suppose to do? That alone would have made this particular horror worthwhile.
As to why anyone would want to hot-wire their noggin is beyond my scope of understanding. Wouldn't sticking your finger in a light socket fundamentally do the same thing (or is this reserved exclusively for the Angela Davis look)?
kazoo
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 14, 2001, at 1:53:55
In reply to Re: Atypical depression ECT-Experiences needed., posted by steve on March 12, 2001, at 18:20:48
> If you have had such brain damage, how do you even know you got ECT?
>
> < /sarcasm >Sarcasm should be avoided here. If it continues, I'll need to try to block you from posting. Thanks,
Bob
PS: Follow-ups, if any, to this should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration.
Posted by willow on March 14, 2001, at 12:34:31
In reply to Re: please be civil » steve, posted by Dr. Bob on March 14, 2001, at 1:53:55
I believe I heard this on the news this morning, may be wrong about the source, that ECT treatment didn't last. 85% of peoples depression returned within four or six months. Did anyone else hear more about this? I'll do a search on yahoo Canada's news site and post and links I find.
Willow
Posted by Noa on March 14, 2001, at 15:01:30
In reply to ECT effectiveness?, posted by willow on March 14, 2001, at 12:34:31
Yes, I saw it. I think the report said that the study showed that ECT alone did not prevent relapse after 6 months, and nortriptyline alone did not prevent relapse, but combined they had a good relapse prevention record. Sorry I don't remember the exact figures.
Posted by Mr. Scott on March 14, 2001, at 18:15:31
In reply to ECT effectiveness?, posted by willow on March 14, 2001, at 12:34:31
> I believe I heard this on the news this morning, may be wrong about the source, that ECT treatment didn't last. 85% of peoples depression returned within four or six months. Did anyone else hear more about this? I'll do a search on yahoo Canada's news site and post and links I find.
>
> WillowNo personal experience with ECT, but I heard recently if you move in right afterwards with Lithium and of course an antidepressant the relapse rates go down dramatically, due to the Lithium.
Posted by steve on March 15, 2001, at 2:02:20
In reply to ECT effectiveness?, posted by willow on March 14, 2001, at 12:34:31
> I believe I heard this on the news this morning, may be wrong about the source, that ECT treatment didn't last. 85% of peoples depression returned within four or six months. Did anyone else hear more about this? I'll do a search on yahoo Canada's news site and post and links I find.
>
> WillowMy shrink, who took a course of fellowship or whatever it's called on ECT under Sackheim or whatever his name is, the ECT guru who thinks the voltage should be higher and is highly respected among ECT-administrators, told me that he would never give ECT because not only does it cause memory loss, and wear off, but that it is not infrequent for people who used to respond to medications to no longer do so after ECT. They guy's paid his dues, is hardly as cynical as I am about the industry, yet thinks it's categorically a bad idea.
Hope this helps,
S.
Posted by Noa on March 15, 2001, at 7:51:39
In reply to Re: ECT effectiveness?, posted by steve on March 15, 2001, at 2:02:20
that was reported in the news this week:
Posted by vince on March 15, 2001, at 12:09:29
In reply to ECT effectiveness?, posted by willow on March 14, 2001, at 12:34:31
> I believe I heard this on the news this morning, may be wrong about the source, that ECT treatment didn't last. 85% of peoples depression returned within four or six months. Did anyone else hear more about this? I'll do a search on yahoo Canada's news site and post and links I find.
>
> WillowJust long enough to remember who you are.
Vince
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
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