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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 8 to 32 of 32. Go back in thread:
Posted by CarolAnn on February 4, 2000, at 9:31:35
In reply to Re: Lair Update, posted by Noa on February 4, 2000, at 3:26:56
Here's my thing:
I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff that other people can use. My thing is getting rid of stuff that really needs to go in the trash. I have tons of plasic bags and plastic containers and other stuff which I can't bring myself to throw away because...Okay, here it is...I am obsessed with recycling. I just feel this tremendous guilt if I throw away anything that should be recyclable, but *isn't* where I live. I feel guilty about sending anything "non-biodegradable" to the landfill. Although, I must admit I do use disposable diapers, but I feel really bad about it! Anyway, There it is, anyone else have anything even remotely similar going on? Probably not, you're all probably thinking, "geez, that is weird!". CarolAnn
Posted by Noa on February 4, 2000, at 12:36:13
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by CarolAnn on February 4, 2000, at 9:31:35
Not at all wierd. I feel that too, maybe not as intensely as you. I think I deal with it by using the defense called "denial" which we humans are good at: just don't think about the impact of your everyday actions on our world.
You would go NUTS here at the school I work at! The cafeteria uses a lot of polystyrene that doesn't get recycled.
Posted by Cindy W on February 4, 2000, at 22:01:45
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by Noa on February 4, 2000, at 12:36:13
> Not at all wierd. I feel that too, maybe not as intensely as you. I think I deal with it by using the defense called "denial" which we humans are good at: just don't think about the impact of your everyday actions on our world.
>
> You would go NUTS here at the school I work at! The cafeteria uses a lot of polystyrene that doesn't get recycled.
CarolAnn, part of my OCD is saving things that I intend to recycle but never do (tons of plastic bags, plastic containers, old batteries, pens that don't work, etc. etc.). This is part of my OCD (feeling responsible for everything, animate and inanimate). You might want to read up on OCD and see if that might be why it's so hard to throw things away.--Cindy W
Posted by torchgrl on February 4, 2000, at 22:33:09
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by Cindy W on February 4, 2000, at 22:01:45
> > Not at all wierd. I feel that too, maybe not as intensely as you. I think I deal with it by using the defense called "denial" which we humans are good at: just don't think about the impact of your everyday actions on our world.
> >
> > You would go NUTS here at the school I work at! The cafeteria uses a lot of polystyrene that doesn't get recycled.
> CarolAnn, part of my OCD is saving things that I intend to recycle but never do (tons of plastic bags, plastic containers, old batteries, pens that don't work, etc. etc.). This is part of my OCD (feeling responsible for everything, animate and inanimate). You might want to read up on OCD and see if that might be why it's so hard to throw things away.--Cindy WEeks--reading this thread is definitely reminding me of myself. I'm always saving things that I should recycle, or that I feel should have some useful function (empty boxes etc.), or that I may come up for a use for some day. As well as the whole unfinished business/failure aspect. Periodically, I find myself in Noa's position, and get rid of a ton of stuff in order to simplify, but it's never enough, and it always builds up again. I don't think I'm bonafide OCD, but there are definitely some aspects there... As I sit here tonight, I'm surrounded by stacks of magazines and newspapers that I either feel I need to read (regardless of their age), or I've read and I don't think I'll remember the useful info, so I need to keep (like I'm going to remember that there IS useful info)--when I decide I should throw them away, I can't do it without looking through to make sure I'm not throwing away something useful, then I find something and I'm right back where I started... AAAGH! I should just eliminate periodicals from my life :)
Posted by CarolAnn on February 5, 2000, at 9:42:31
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by torchgrl on February 4, 2000, at 22:33:09
I am a magazine fanatic! I get quite a few monthly and also buy interesting looking ones in stores. I have always had the same problem of having stacks of them from months and months ago lying around, because I either thought their was or knew their was something in them that I wanted to save. Finally, in a rare instance of extreme clutter clearance, I not only got rid of them all(donated them to the library), but came up with a plan to keep them from piling up. Here it is:
I made a rule that when I pick up a new magazine, as I read it, I immediately tear out any article, recipe, ect. that I think I want to keep. If I can't finish the magazine in one sitting, I mark my place, so that I will not go thru pages already read(I am quite capable of forgetting I've read something and wasting time on it.). Anyway, the pages I tear out go in a file, and the finished magazine immediately goes in a designated "donate to library bag", never to be picked up again. About every other month I go thru the file of magazine clippings, and anything that has not been used or had an actual planned time of use, is thrown away. This might all sound like a lot of trouble, but it's really not. I have found that a lot of things that I might have saved a magazine for, become less compelling, if I start to decide whether or not to actually tear the page out. Well, it works for me, and I like not having whole magazines to make "get rid of or keep" decisions about. Hope some of you find this helpful.CarolAnn
Posted by Renee N on February 5, 2000, at 18:44:07
In reply to Re: the thing with magazines..., posted by CarolAnn on February 5, 2000, at 9:42:31
> I am a magazine fanatic! I get quite a few monthly and also buy interesting looking ones in stores. I have always had the same problem of having stacks of them from months and months ago lying around, because I either thought their was or knew their was something in them that I wanted to save. Finally, in a rare instance of extreme clutter clearance, I not only got rid of them all(donated them to the library), but came up with a plan to keep them from piling up. Here it is:
> I made a rule that when I pick up a new magazine, as I read it, I immediately tear out any article, recipe, ect. that I think I want to keep. If I can't finish the magazine in one sitting, I mark my place, so that I will not go thru pages already read(I am quite capable of forgetting I've read something and wasting time on it.). Anyway, the pages I tear out go in a file, and the finished magazine immediately goes in a designated "donate to library bag", never to be picked up again. About every other month I go thru the file of magazine clippings, and anything that has not been used or had an actual planned time of use, is thrown away. This might all sound like a lot of trouble, but it's really not. I have found that a lot of things that I might have saved a magazine for, become less compelling, if I start to decide whether or not to actually tear the page out. Well, it works for me, and I like not having whole magazines to make "get rid of or keep" decisions about. Hope some of you find this helpful.CarolAnnGreat idea, Carol Ann! I didn't think I had this problem, but then my daughter started in on me about my reading material being all over the house. I also get many more books from the library tahn anyone could possibly read. Well, I do read at least parts of most of them. At least on here everything is saved for us and doesn't take up any physical space in our homes!
Posted by sandi on February 6, 2000, at 18:22:39
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by CarolAnn on February 4, 2000, at 9:31:35
> Here's my thing:
> I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff that other people can use. My thing is getting rid of stuff that really needs to go in the trash. I have tons of plasic bags and plastic containers and other stuff which I can't bring myself to throw away because...Okay, here it is...I am obsessed with recycling. I just feel this tremendous guilt if I throw away anything that should be recyclable, but *isn't* where I live. I feel guilty about sending anything "non-biodegradable" to the landfill. Although, I must admit I do use disposable diapers, but I feel really bad about it! Anyway, There it is, anyone else have anything even remotely similar going on? Probably not, you're all probably thinking, "geez, that is weird!". CarolAnn
CarolAnn-Honey, I do the same thing and have done it for years!!!!! It drives my parents crazy!! I moved to a new house in 1998 and they took it upon themselves to do things like organize my garage and attic while I was at work. I begged them not to throw out anything so they put it in boxes and put it in the attic. Get this, I live alone (except for my dog) in a three bedroom, three bath house with a very large bonus room and garage and EVERY closet, EVERY cabinet, EVERY shelf, EVERYTHING is filled to capacity. I have stacks of magazines, catalogs, plastic containers, and PLASTIC GROCERY SACKS. I currently have 2 33-gal. Hefty sacks full of plastic grocery sacks!!!! My dad begged me when I moved to not collect the things but I could not stop myself from sticking them in my pantry. It got so full that I could no longer see the food stored there and I would open the door just long enough to fling them in there then slam it before any escaped. My garage is now filling up and I only have a space just large enough to pull my truck in. So, you're not alone. If you think of a solution, let me know. Otherwise, I will remain forever--Full Of It.------sandi
Posted by mary on February 6, 2000, at 19:00:55
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by sandi on February 6, 2000, at 18:22:39
My car doesn't fit any more. At least there is still room for lawn mower.
Mary
> > Here's my thing:
> > I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff that other people can use. My thing is getting rid of stuff that really needs to go in the trash. I have tons of plasic bags and plastic containers and other stuff which I can't bring myself to throw away because...Okay, here it is...I am obsessed with recycling. I just feel this tremendous guilt if I throw away anything that should be recyclable, but *isn't* where I live. I feel guilty about sending anything "non-biodegradable" to the landfill. Although, I must admit I do use disposable diapers, but I feel really bad about it! Anyway, There it is, anyone else have anything even remotely similar going on? Probably not, you're all probably thinking, "geez, that is weird!". CarolAnn
>
>
> CarolAnn-Honey, I do the same thing and have done it for years!!!!! It drives my parents crazy!! I moved to a new house in 1998 and they took it upon themselves to do things like organize my garage and attic while I was at work. I begged them not to throw out anything so they put it in boxes and put it in the attic. Get this, I live alone (except for my dog) in a three bedroom, three bath house with a very large bonus room and garage and EVERY closet, EVERY cabinet, EVERY shelf, EVERYTHING is filled to capacity. I have stacks of magazines, catalogs, plastic containers, and PLASTIC GROCERY SACKS. I currently have 2 33-gal. Hefty sacks full of plastic grocery sacks!!!! My dad begged me when I moved to not collect the things but I could not stop myself from sticking them in my pantry. It got so full that I could no longer see the food stored there and I would open the door just long enough to fling them in there then slam it before any escaped. My garage is now filling up and I only have a space just large enough to pull my truck in. So, you're not alone. If you think of a solution, let me know. Otherwise, I will remain forever--Full Of It.------sandi
Posted by Noa on February 6, 2000, at 22:15:33
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by mary on February 6, 2000, at 19:00:55
If someone were to send a recycling truck tomorrow to take all that plastic and paper away, would you get rid of the stuff? What would it feel like if it were gone (to a proper recycling plant)?
Posted by CarolAnn on February 7, 2000, at 9:56:28
In reply to Re: question for the recyclers, posted by Noa on February 6, 2000, at 22:15:33
>>> If someone were to send a recycling truck tomorrow to take all that plastic and paper away, would you get rid of the stuff? What would it feel like if it were gone (to a proper recycling plant)? >>>
Noa, good question. I, for one, would feel totally cleansed. I would have no problem at all, as long as I knew that all the stuff was going to be recycled. And if there were a regular, once a week, truck like that, I would be able to shed a lot of guilt feelings, which I have everytime I purchase something that comes in such packaging. CarolAnn
Posted by Quilter on February 8, 2000, at 0:58:53
In reply to Re: my answer, posted by CarolAnn on February 7, 2000, at 9:56:28
> >>> If someone were to send a recycling truck tomorrow to take all that plastic and paper away, would you get rid of the stuff? What would it feel like if it were gone (to a proper recycling plant)? >>>
>
> Noa, good question. I, for one, would feel totally cleansed. I would have no problem at all, as long as I knew that all the stuff was going to be recycled. And if there were a regular, once a week, truck like that, I would be able to shed a lot of guilt feelings, which I have everytime I purchase something that comes in such packaging. CarolAnnHave any of you recyclers tried checking the recycling programs in nearby communities to see if they handle materials your community doesn't? This might involve transportation and perhaps fee payment but might be a feasible option.
Posted by Kim on February 8, 2000, at 20:37:04
In reply to Re: my answer, posted by Quilter on February 8, 2000, at 0:58:53
Hoarding--does anyone else save stuff that might be valuable someday? I make my husband nuts with all the fast food toys, etc, that I've got.
Second problem is saving every bit of paper that has anything to do with my or the rest of the family's life because SOMEDAY I'm going to organize it all and make wonderful scrapbooks.
Kim
Posted by Cindy W on February 8, 2000, at 21:52:18
In reply to "It might be worth something someday", posted by Kim on February 8, 2000, at 20:37:04
> Hoarding--does anyone else save stuff that might be valuable someday? I make my husband nuts with all the fast food toys, etc, that I've got.
>
> Second problem is saving every bit of paper that has anything to do with my or the rest of the family's life because SOMEDAY I'm going to organize it all and make wonderful scrapbooks.
>
> KimKim, I wouldn't save things that were totally worthless. Not only might they be valuable someday, I might run out of something and wish I hadn't thrown it away. (Wish I had all my childhood treasures, which would be worth a fortune now, like Mad Magazines!).--Cindy W
Posted by torchgrl on February 9, 2000, at 0:42:55
In reply to "It might be worth something someday", posted by Kim on February 8, 2000, at 20:37:04
> Hoarding--does anyone else save stuff that might be valuable someday? I make my husband nuts with all the fast food toys, etc, that I've got.
>
> Second problem is saving every bit of paper that has anything to do with my or the rest of the family's life because SOMEDAY I'm going to organize it all and make wonderful scrapbooks.
>
> KimI'm very guilty of this too. A box of random X-Files stuff--sure to be worth something, right?:) Maybe even more the longer I keep it...meanwhile, it's just taking up room in my bedroom, but there's NO way I can get rid of it. And my mother had to store a bunch of shoeboxes full of "mementos" from my high-school years when she moved a few years back. I think there are *several* different reasons I'm plagued with so much clutter, some better than others!
Posted by eleanor on April 13, 2000, at 13:31:14
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by mary on February 6, 2000, at 19:00:55
> My car doesn't fit any more. At least there is still room for lawn mower.
>
> Mary
>
> > > Here's my thing:
> > > I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff that other people can use. My thing is getting rid of stuff that really needs to go in the trash. I have tons of plasic bags and plastic containers and other stuff which I can't bring myself to throw away because...Okay, here it is...I am obsessed with recycling. I just feel this tremendous guilt if I throw away anything that should be recyclable, but *isn't* where I live. I feel guilty about sending anything "non-biodegradable" to the landfill. Although, I must admit I do use disposable diapers, but I feel really bad about it! Anyway, There it is, anyone else have anything even remotely similar going on? Probably not, you're all probably thinking, "geez, that is weird!". CarolAnn
> >
> >
> > CarolAnn-Honey, I do the same thing and have done it for years!!!!! It drives my parents crazy!! I moved to a new house in 1998 and they took it upon themselves to do things like organize my garage and attic while I was at work. I begged them not to throw out anything so they put it in boxes and put it in the attic. Get this, I live alone (except for my dog) in a three bedroom, three bath house with a very large bonus room and garage and EVERY closet, EVERY cabinet, EVERY shelf, EVERYTHING is filled to capacity. I have stacks of magazines, catalogs, plastic containers, and PLASTIC GROCERY SACKS. I currently have 2 33-gal. Hefty sacks full of plastic grocery sacks!!!! My dad begged me when I moved to not collect the things but I could not stop myself from sticking them in my pantry. It got so full that I could no longer see the food stored there and I would open the door just long enough to fling them in there then slam it before any escaped. My garage is now filling up and I only have a space just large enough to pull my truck in. So, you're not alone. If you think of a solution, let me know. Otherwise, I will remain forever--Full Of It.------sandiif your friends and family are concerned about your hoarding it might be a good idea to see a psychiatrist. You might have obsessive compulsive disease. There is medication that could possible free you from this compulsion to save.
Posted by Cindy W on April 13, 2000, at 21:22:04
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by eleanor on April 13, 2000, at 13:31:14
> > My car doesn't fit any more. At least there is still room for lawn mower.
> >
> > Mary
> >
> > > > Here's my thing:
> > > > I don't have a problem getting rid of stuff that other people can use. My thing is getting rid of stuff that really needs to go in the trash. I have tons of plasic bags and plastic containers and other stuff which I can't bring myself to throw away because...Okay, here it is...I am obsessed with recycling. I just feel this tremendous guilt if I throw away anything that should be recyclable, but *isn't* where I live. I feel guilty about sending anything "non-biodegradable" to the landfill. Although, I must admit I do use disposable diapers, but I feel really bad about it! Anyway, There it is, anyone else have anything even remotely similar going on? Probably not, you're all probably thinking, "geez, that is weird!". CarolAnn
> > >
> > >
> > > CarolAnn-Honey, I do the same thing and have done it for years!!!!! It drives my parents crazy!! I moved to a new house in 1998 and they took it upon themselves to do things like organize my garage and attic while I was at work. I begged them not to throw out anything so they put it in boxes and put it in the attic. Get this, I live alone (except for my dog) in a three bedroom, three bath house with a very large bonus room and garage and EVERY closet, EVERY cabinet, EVERY shelf, EVERYTHING is filled to capacity. I have stacks of magazines, catalogs, plastic containers, and PLASTIC GROCERY SACKS. I currently have 2 33-gal. Hefty sacks full of plastic grocery sacks!!!! My dad begged me when I moved to not collect the things but I could not stop myself from sticking them in my pantry. It got so full that I could no longer see the food stored there and I would open the door just long enough to fling them in there then slam it before any escaped. My garage is now filling up and I only have a space just large enough to pull my truck in. So, you're not alone. If you think of a solution, let me know. Otherwise, I will remain forever--Full Of It.------sandi
>
> if your friends and family are concerned about your hoarding it might be a good idea to see a psychiatrist. You might have obsessive compulsive disease. There is medication that could possible free you from this compulsion to save.CarolAnn and Eleanor, I'm a hoarder too! I have finally been able to throw away most of my plastic bags and plastic containers and stuff like that, but can't (so far) part with zillions of thrift store clothes that don't fit. I've been taking Effexor-XR, which helps with the guilty thinking/obsessions, and am trying to set goals for myself. Check out the H-C List at www.onelist.com; it is an email list for hoarders/clutters, and people are very nice, sharing their goals and reinforcing each other when they meet them and giving suggestions. They have helped me a lot! My car has improved, but I have a long ways to go (still have thrown out only half the magazines). Best wishes to you!
Posted by KarenB on April 14, 2000, at 10:30:49
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by Cindy W on April 13, 2000, at 21:22:04
You guys,
I have been accused of having the opposite problem - I LOVE to get rid of things. It's fun to decide who may have use of whatever it is and give it away. If I am not wearing an item of clothing on a regular basis, IT'S OUTTA HERE! Fortunately for my family, I don't get crazy with anyone else's things, just my own and the things I am responsible for. It's great. There is a lot to be said for minimalism. The more "stuff" you have, as far as I am concerned, the more it is a liability. Harder to move if you want to, that sort of thing. Geez, I even threw away my high school yearbook several years back. It only brought back bad memories (drug use, drinking, getting in trouble, unhealthy relationships) so out it went. I'm glad I did it.
I do keep photographs forever, though and every single craft or drawing my children have done.
In late '93, we sold everything we owned and took off for the Philippines, where we started a Christian leadership school for Filipino adults. We were there for five years. Owning nothing but our clothes was the best feeling I have ever had. What freedom!
Anybody relate to this or am I the weird one?
Karen
Posted by Cindy W on April 15, 2000, at 10:36:16
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by KarenB on April 14, 2000, at 10:30:49
> You guys,
>
> I have been accused of having the opposite problem - I LOVE to get rid of things. It's fun to decide who may have use of whatever it is and give it away. If I am not wearing an item of clothing on a regular basis, IT'S OUTTA HERE! Fortunately for my family, I don't get crazy with anyone else's things, just my own and the things I am responsible for. It's great. There is a lot to be said for minimalism. The more "stuff" you have, as far as I am concerned, the more it is a liability. Harder to move if you want to, that sort of thing. Geez, I even threw away my high school yearbook several years back. It only brought back bad memories (drug use, drinking, getting in trouble, unhealthy relationships) so out it went. I'm glad I did it.
>
> I do keep photographs forever, though and every single craft or drawing my children have done.
>
> In late '93, we sold everything we owned and took off for the Philippines, where we started a Christian leadership school for Filipino adults. We were there for five years. Owning nothing but our clothes was the best feeling I have ever had. What freedom!
>
> Anybody relate to this or am I the weird one?
>
> KarenKaren, sounds like a wonderful way to be! I'm very envious. Would you please come to my home and throw things away? 8) Best wishes!
Posted by JanetR on April 15, 2000, at 17:47:32
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by Cindy W on April 15, 2000, at 10:36:16
> > You guys,
> >
> > I have been accused of having the opposite problem - I LOVE to get rid of things. It's fun to decide who may have use of whatever it is and give it away. If I am not wearing an item of clothing on a regular basis, IT'S OUTTA HERE! Fortunately for my family, I don't get crazy with anyone else's things, just my own and the things I am responsible for. It's great. There is a lot to be said for minimalism. The more "stuff" you have, as far as I am concerned, the more it is a liability. Harder to move if you want to, that sort of thing. Geez, I even threw away my high school yearbook several years back. It only brought back bad memories (drug use, drinking, getting in trouble, unhealthy relationships) so out it went. I'm glad I did it.
> >
> > I do keep photographs forever, though and every single craft or drawing my children have done.
> >
> > In late '93, we sold everything we owned and took off for the Philippines, where we started a Christian leadership school for Filipino adults. We were there for five years. Owning nothing but our clothes was the best feeling I have ever had. What freedom!
> >
> > Anybody relate to this or am I the weird one?
> >
> > Karen
>
> Karen, sounds like a wonderful way to be! I'm very envious. Would you please come to my home and throw things away? 8) Best wishes!Dear Karen, I'm exactly the same. I've written previously about how I have no proprietary feelings about anything. I give stuff away as soon as I have no use for it. I think not having stuff is a kind of liberation. Unfortunately, my husband is a hoarder. He hangs onto old vynil records etc. I also find it easier to move on than stay put. Apparently, this type of behaviour is related to ADD. One of the many positive aspects of the disorder.My dream is one day to live in a place with just the things I use and no excess baggage. Jan
Posted by Renee N on April 15, 2000, at 19:38:29
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by JanetR on April 15, 2000, at 17:47:32
I'm with you! I have moved many times, and find no fun in moving things I don't need. My husband has moved pieces of plywood across country "just in case he needs them someday". The truth is he does make good use out of the things he keeps, eventually. I figure if I ever gain or loose weight, I would rather have an excuse to get a new wardrovbe than drag out old stuff! The minute my second child was done with any baby equipment, it was gone. I do love to have and go to garage sales. I love a bargain. When I have grandchildren I can buy what I need for them cheap enough at garage sales. I do not like to clean house. Dusting is especially loathesome. The more stuff you have, the more you have to organize, clean, have room for, know where to find, etc. Less IS more. Renee N
Posted by boB on April 15, 2000, at 20:43:24
In reply to To Karen and Janet, posted by Renee N on April 15, 2000, at 19:38:29
This hoarding/spartan discussion is interesting. I have lots of books - at least half-a-ton, which I recently carried up a long set stairs, and might move again in three weeks if I get a job somewhere else. I have also abandonded or lost dear possession along the way, and I am considering dumping most of my unworn clothing if I move very soon.
But there seems something circular in the tendency to diagnose a supposedly organic brain disorder based on how many possessions one drags around. If that is the case, our society is all very much obssessed, because we are very much addicted to purchasing consumer goods. Bags of thrift store clothes are no more evidence or hoarding than are three cars, a jet ski, seven television sets and a summer home.
The relation of hoarding to mental disease started, I think, by examining the lifestyle of severely affected individuals. The circularity begins when we then say hoarding is evidence of a "disease" because some people with the disease have been known to hoard.
Posted by Cindy W on April 18, 2000, at 8:47:56
In reply to Hoarding consumer goods, posted by boB on April 15, 2000, at 20:43:24
> This hoarding/spartan discussion is interesting. I have lots of books - at least half-a-ton, which I recently carried up a long set stairs, and might move again in three weeks if I get a job somewhere else. I have also abandonded or lost dear possession along the way, and I am considering dumping most of my unworn clothing if I move very soon.
>
> But there seems something circular in the tendency to diagnose a supposedly organic brain disorder based on how many possessions one drags around. If that is the case, our society is all very much obssessed, because we are very much addicted to purchasing consumer goods. Bags of thrift store clothes are no more evidence or hoarding than are three cars, a jet ski, seven television sets and a summer home.
>
> The relation of hoarding to mental disease started, I think, by examining the lifestyle of severely affected individuals. The circularity begins when we then say hoarding is evidence of a "disease" because some people with the disease have been known to hoard.boB, As someone with OCD, I wanted to let you know it isn't a matter of circular definition. Just having stuff isn't OCD. I cannot walk through my house without tripping. I can hardly use my house. It is just a storage place for things I don't really need. Someone with valuable possessions uses them; I rarely use the stuff I have hoarded (I just get it to decrease anxiety). Having thousands of thrift store clothes I never wear has taken a toll on my life (it interferes with a lot...people can't visit, repairmen can't come fix things, I live in fear others will "find out", etc). Maybe it's a matter of degree, but it is also a matter of how much it interfere's with one's ability to be happy and function.
Posted by KarenB on April 18, 2000, at 16:42:14
In reply to Re: a different kind of hoarding..., posted by JanetR on April 15, 2000, at 17:47:32
> > > You guys,
> > >
> > > I have been accused of having the opposite problem - I LOVE to get rid of things. It's fun to decide who may have use of whatever it is and give it away. If I am not wearing an item of clothing on a regular basis, IT'S OUTTA HERE! Fortunately for my family, I don't get crazy with anyone else's things, just my own and the things I am responsible for. It's great. There is a lot to be said for minimalism. The more "stuff" you have, as far as I am concerned, the more it is a liability. Harder to move if you want to, that sort of thing. Geez, I even threw away my high school yearbook several years back. It only brought back bad memories (drug use, drinking, getting in trouble, unhealthy relationships) so out it went. I'm glad I did it.
> > >
> > > I do keep photographs forever, though and every single craft or drawing my children have done.
> > >
> > > In late '93, we sold everything we owned and took off for the Philippines, where we started a Christian leadership school for Filipino adults. We were there for five years. Owning nothing but our clothes was the best feeling I have ever had. What freedom!
> > >
> > > Anybody relate to this or am I the weird one?
> > >
> > > Karen
> >
> > Karen, sounds like a wonderful way to be! I'm very envious. Would you please come to my home and throw things away? 8) Best wishes!
>
> Dear Karen, I'm exactly the same. I've written previously about how I have no proprietary feelings about anything. I give stuff away as soon as I have no use for it. I think not having stuff is a kind of liberation. Unfortunately, my husband is a hoarder. He hangs onto old vynil records etc. I also find it easier to move on than stay put. Apparently, this type of behaviour is related to ADD. One of the many positive aspects of the disorder.My dream is one day to live in a place with just the things I use and no excess baggage. JanJanet,
I had no idea this was part of the ADD but I have been this way all my life. I also never get upset at goodbyes and people dying doesn't affect me too much, either. I always wondered if there was something wrong with me because of that.
Thanks for your post - I know I'm not alone.
Karen
Posted by boB on April 18, 2000, at 17:16:07
In reply to Re: Hoarding consumer goods, posted by Cindy W on April 18, 2000, at 8:47:56
> Cindy,
I agree with you that the relation of hoarding to disease is a matter of degree, but I see the relative matter one of defining disease, not of how much one hoards and how it effects their life. A person, such as myself, might hoard as much as you do, and decline to invite people over etc, because of our sloppy house, and be unhappy, but choose not to consider it a matter of disease. It is the belief in a system of diagnosis that makes it a disease. One might even have anomylous neurobiological conditions consistant with an accepted western academic model of obsessive compulsive disorder, but accept their condition as one of nature, and an appropriately diverse behavior of a highly varied species.
I don't normally confront people who choose to call their condition a disease until they insist that my condition, which is identical to theirs, is also disease. At that point, I feel people are using me unwillingly to confirm thier world view, and I resist. But I also suspect that many of the same synaptic conditions associated with OCD are typical of consumer behavior in general. Consumer behavior is not stigmatized in the same way as the hoarding of used things, as you and I do. Especially around Christmas time, people engage in a virtual orgy of mutual hoarding that is in my view pathological. The difference is that our culture does not want to consider this behavior diseased, no matter how many people are negatively effected.
Posted by Cindy W on April 18, 2000, at 21:14:21
In reply to Re: Hoarding consumer goods, posted by boB on April 18, 2000, at 17:16:07
> > Cindy,
>
> I agree with you that the relation of hoarding to disease is a matter of degree, but I see the relative matter one of defining disease, not of how much one hoards and how it effects their life. A person, such as myself, might hoard as much as you do, and decline to invite people over etc, because of our sloppy house, and be unhappy, but choose not to consider it a matter of disease. It is the belief in a system of diagnosis that makes it a disease. One might even have anomylous neurobiological conditions consistant with an accepted western academic model of obsessive compulsive disorder, but accept their condition as one of nature, and an appropriately diverse behavior of a highly varied species.
>
> I don't normally confront people who choose to call their condition a disease until they insist that my condition, which is identical to theirs, is also disease. At that point, I feel people are using me unwillingly to confirm thier world view, and I resist. But I also suspect that many of the same synaptic conditions associated with OCD are typical of consumer behavior in general. Consumer behavior is not stigmatized in the same way as the hoarding of used things, as you and I do. Especially around Christmas time, people engage in a virtual orgy of mutual hoarding that is in my view pathological. The difference is that our culture does not want to consider this behavior diseased, no matter how many people are negatively effected.boB, i don't have a problem with what you want to call it...i just choose to call it ocd (my computer is acting weird, won't let me capitalize...sorry!) because it gives me a handle on strategies to try to reduce it and a common reference point with other people who choose to call it ocd. BTW, i agree that compulsive shopping probably is associated with the same "synaptic conditions." i just have found that the biological model and cognitive behavioral models at least provide a more effective treatment than the old psychodynamic theories (which postulated all kinds of weird hangups).
This is the end of the thread.
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