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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Fallen4MyT on December 22, 2004, at 22:57:22
In reply to Re: A strange thought perhaps but » Fallen4MyT, posted by crushedout on December 22, 2004, at 22:54:28
OK no problem good luck on whatever you decide I just won't post to you. The coin flip was one of many ideas but anyhow I really hope you find peace in whatever you do
HUGS
> who is "we," fallen? i don't like being told to flip a coin. i disagreed with some of what you said. i'm not going to pretend to agree with things i don't agree with, ok? please just let it drop. i know you mean well, but this is not helpful to me.
Posted by crushedout on December 22, 2004, at 23:28:39
In reply to Re: A strange thought perhaps but » crushedout, posted by Fallen4MyT on December 22, 2004, at 22:57:22
Well, although this thread has turned out to be rather trying and frustrating to me (for whatever reasons), I wanted to let everyone know that I haven't acted on my urge to see her, and am trying to sit with my feelings of ambivalence and be patient, see where they take me. I don't want to act when things are still so unclear. I think you were right, falls, that I need to try talking this through with the new T first. And if that doesn't work, perhaps I'll look for the strength to find another T (ugh).
No way am I getting a male T, though. That just feels way wrong to me (no offense to men, I just don't want one as a T and I'm pretty sure it wouldn't work for me).
In general, I'm feeling a bit better, perhaps a little on the manic side. But I'm not miserably depressed. Just wanted to share this.
Posted by Rigby on December 22, 2004, at 23:56:55
In reply to Re: A strange thought perhaps but » crushedout, posted by Fallen4MyT on December 22, 2004, at 22:45:03
Like Fallen4 said, I think you need to be clear that you want a certain type of support--otherwise, when you post you'll get various perspectives and opinions.
As far as my feelings are concerned, I spent time thinking about your situation and really trying to come up with the best response that I could for you. To have you respond by saying that I don't get it and that I think you're doing therapy wrong and wasting your life is not only a misinterpration of my message but it's disrespectful of me and the time and thought I put into your situation.
Good luck.
> But Crushed all we can do is try and you do not like what we think is supportive. You say you like 1 persons support. I think you know my situation with my T so I feel I am VERY neutral in this more so than really anyone who has posted to you. So yes support comes in many forms and helpful is WHAT??? that was the point of my last post was for you to maybe ask yourself why most of the helpful posts I have read in here...to you seem to be.. to you... NOT supportive or helpful?? I am not being difficult either I just know how you feel to some extent being one to cross lines and all myself and the fence sitting is not good for you I can read and hear the stress in all your replies. So I can only support you how I would want to be supported and I would ask myself WHAT IS IT I AM NOT GETTING THAT I WANT TO HEAR IN HERE...AND maybe post it to yourself or for all of us to see what you need or want? I really FEEL for your PAIN and frustration I REALLY DO...but I feel that youre biting a lot of hands that are typing and trying to help. I CARE . I do not care what you do I CARE that you do DO something to stop this agony for yourself. I am not saying its easy man of anyone in here I would know that best. I hope you try what I said it just MIGHT help you find what you need and want but maybe arent sure yourself on.
>
>
> > That's not completely true. For example, I liked Dinah's reply, as I made pretty clear in my response to it. She validated my feelings without telling me what to do.
> >
> > I'm not looking for answers. There are no easy answers to this problem. I'm just trying to get helpful feedback and support. That can come in many forms. It's hard to say exactly what I'm looking for because it's not that specific.
> >
> > I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just looking for help and some kinds of help are not helpful.
>
>
Posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 0:15:32
In reply to I'm With Fallen On This One, posted by Rigby on December 22, 2004, at 23:56:55
I'm sorry you feel I was disrespectful, Rigby. I was just telling you how I read your post. *I* felt disrespected, but maybe I misinterpreted. That can happen.
As I said to Fallen, I don't know exactly what sorts of responses I want when I post. I know I don't want my feelings to be minimized, I don't want to be demoralized, and I don't want to be condescended to. But I assume all that goes without saying. I don't expect everyone to always give me exactly what I want, but I also will disagree with things that I don't agree with, and I may have feelings in response to a post (even if the poster put a lot of thought into it). It seems to me that's the nature of human interaction.
And, please, Rigby, don't do me any more favors. *Especially* if I'm not allowed to have a response to them. Those are favors I don't need.
Posted by Fallen4MyT on December 23, 2004, at 0:34:12
In reply to I'm With Fallen On This One, posted by Rigby on December 22, 2004, at 23:56:55
Rigby I wasn't going to say anything on how I FEEL but now that you said it I too feel very hurt by all the time I spent trying to help and how much of what I said was also misinterprated in a disrespectful way. I have NO problem with someone saying this isn't what they want or need but I have never had anyone in all the time I have been on Babble be so disrespectful of my time and that of other poster's time and feelings. FEELING PUT DOWN is an understatement. A sinple thank you OR THANK YOU BUT ....would have been fine. I do not care to argue and thats what most of this thread has been. I am done with this and do wish Crushed well.
> Like Fallen4 said, I think you need to be clear that you want a certain type of support--otherwise, when you post you'll get various perspectives and opinions.
>
> As far as my feelings are concerned, I spent time thinking about your situation and really trying to come up with the best response that I could for you. To have you respond by saying that I don't get it and that I think you're doing therapy wrong and wasting your life is not only a misinterpration of my message but it's disrespectful of me and the time and thought I put into your situation.
>
> Good luck.
>
> > But Crushed all we can do is try and you do not like what we think is supportive. You say you like 1 persons support. I think you know my situation with my T so I feel I am VERY neutral in this more so than really anyone who has posted to you. So yes support comes in many forms and helpful is WHAT??? that was the point of my last post was for you to maybe ask yourself why most of the helpful posts I have read in here...to you seem to be.. to you... NOT supportive or helpful?? I am not being difficult either I just know how you feel to some extent being one to cross lines and all myself and the fence sitting is not good for you I can read and hear the stress in all your replies. So I can only support you how I would want to be supported and I would ask myself WHAT IS IT I AM NOT GETTING THAT I WANT TO HEAR IN HERE...AND maybe post it to yourself or for all of us to see what you need or want? I really FEEL for your PAIN and frustration I REALLY DO...but I feel that youre biting a lot of hands that are typing and trying to help. I CARE . I do not care what you do I CARE that you do DO something to stop this agony for yourself. I am not saying its easy man of anyone in here I would know that best. I hope you try what I said it just MIGHT help you find what you need and want but maybe arent sure yourself on.
> >
> >
> > > That's not completely true. For example, I liked Dinah's reply, as I made pretty clear in my response to it. She validated my feelings without telling me what to do.
> > >
> > > I'm not looking for answers. There are no easy answers to this problem. I'm just trying to get helpful feedback and support. That can come in many forms. It's hard to say exactly what I'm looking for because it's not that specific.
> > >
> > > I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just looking for help and some kinds of help are not helpful.
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by gardenergirl on December 23, 2004, at 6:57:05
In reply to Re: I'm With Fallen On This One » Rigby, posted by Fallen4MyT on December 23, 2004, at 0:34:12
Crushed,
I was thinking that perhaps this thread is kind of representative itself of how you might be feeling? It seems like with this conflict, there is not a clear difference between options. At any rate, it's clear you are feeling really awful. I wish there were an easy answer.Somebody I respect a great deal said an interesting thing to me the other day. She said (regarding a different conflict) that sometimes all alternatives are bad. The task, then, is to choose the one that hurts the least. And only you can do that, unfortunately. I wish I could help more.
And I think I can relate about how you posted mostly negative things about your former T, and that only presents one side of it. I tend to complain about the negatives about my husband to my T, and I have to remember to make an effort to say some good things, too. That way I make sure he realizes that my husband really is a good man and not a complete clod. ;)
I do think that if your depression is getting worse with the new T, that is telling. Regardless of whether you are working on the transference or not, alleviating depression is a goal, right?
At any rate, if I could, I would come over and just sit quietly with you in support.
Take care,
gg
Posted by Dinah on December 23, 2004, at 7:24:18
In reply to (((crushed))), posted by gardenergirl on December 23, 2004, at 6:57:05
At the risk of alienating just about everyone, could I suggest a bit of a step back and some deep breaths?
I see that everyone has been putting a lot of effort into their responses and trying really hard to help Crushed with her pain.
I also understand that losing an important connection to a loved one can *feel* like a life threatening event. And bring out the natural responses to life threatening events. Mother lioness and her cub, that sort of thing.
I don't think there's anything personal going on here. And everyone's reactions are perfectly understandable. But if everyone takes a step back and sees how each other's reactions are also perfectly understandable, perhaps we can keep some very valuable connections here on the board strong and maintain important sources of support for everyone involved.
Posted by Dinah on December 23, 2004, at 7:26:04
In reply to Re: I'm very close to going back to old T » Dinah, posted by crushedout on December 22, 2004, at 11:44:49
You're welcome, Crushed. I understand perfectly. And that wasn't convoluted at all.
Posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 13:15:17
In reply to (((crushed))), posted by gardenergirl on December 23, 2004, at 6:57:05
Hi gg,I don't know *what's* going on in this thread but I do know I feel pretty bad about it. I wish I hadn't started it.
Thank you so much for your understanding. And you are SOOOO sweet. I would love to have you here next to me for a while. Just the thought of it gives me comfort.
xox,
crushedout
Posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 13:17:11
In reply to Deep breaths everyone?, posted by Dinah on December 23, 2004, at 7:24:18
Dinah,Thank you so much for this post. We obviously needed a mediator, and you make excellent points, without taking sides. I appreciate it. And I agree with everything you said.
crushed
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 23, 2004, at 13:50:29
In reply to Deep breaths everyone?, posted by Dinah on December 23, 2004, at 7:24:18
> could I suggest a bit of a step back and some deep breaths?
>
> I see that everyone has been putting a lot of effort into their responses and trying really hard to help Crushed with her pain.
>
> everyone's reactions are perfectly understandable. But if everyone takes a step back and sees how each other's reactions are also perfectly understandable, perhaps we can keep some very valuable connections here on the board strong and maintain important sources of support for everyone involved.
>
> DinahThose are all really good ideas. Could I also encourage the use of I-statements? For example, instead of:
> I liked Dinah's reply, as I made pretty clear in my response to it. She validated my feelings without telling me what to do.
>
> I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just looking for help and some kinds of help are not helpful.How about:
> I liked Dinah's reply, as I made pretty clear in my response to it. She validated my feelings and I didn't feel told what to do.
>
> I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just looking for help and some kinds of help I don't find helpful.--
And instead of:
> I really FEEL for your PAIN and frustration I REALLY DO...but I feel that youre biting a lot of hands that are typing and trying to help.
How about:
> I really FEEL for your PAIN and frustration I REALLY DO...but I feel that others that are typing and trying to help feel frustrated, too.
--
And instead of:
> i don't like being told to flip a coin.
How about:
> i don't think flipping a coin would help.
--
And instead of:
> OK no problem good luck on whatever you decide I just won't post to you.
How about:
> OK no problem good luck on whatever you decide, I just feel frustrated.
--
And instead of:
> To have you respond by saying that I don't get it and that I think you're doing therapy wrong and wasting your life is not only a misinterpration of my message but it's disrespectful of me and the time and thought I put into your situation.
How about:
> To have you respond by saying that I don't get it and that I think you're doing therapy wrong and wasting your life made me feel I'm doing posting wrong and wasting the time and thought I put into your situation.
--
And instead of:
> please, Rigby, don't do me any more favors. *Especially* if I'm not allowed to have a response to them. Those are favors I don't need.
How about, well, just skipping that? Or, as Fallen later suggested:
> thanks, Rigby, for trying to help.
--
And instead of:
> I too feel very hurt by all the time I spent trying to help and how much of what I said was also misinterprated in a disrespectful way. I have NO problem with someone saying this isn't what they want or need but I have never had anyone in all the time I have been on Babble be so disrespectful of my time and that of other poster's time and feelings. FEELING PUT DOWN is an understatement.
How about:
> I too feel very hurt. I spent a lot of time trying to help. I have NO problem with someone saying this isn't what they want or need but FEELING PUT DOWN is an understatement.
--
Taking a step back also means time to preview what you've typed:
> Babble is a place ... to learn about my own methods of interaction (what works, what doesn't work, what I should stop / start / do more of.)
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041027/msgs/411257.html
> I have found that babble gives me the opportunity to practice responding rather than reacting to others. Because we aren’t face to face and we write rather than speak we have the opportunity to really think about our posts before hitting ‘submit’.
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20041027/msgs/413401.html
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 13:58:34
In reply to Re: Deep breaths (and I-statements), posted by Dr. Bob on December 23, 2004, at 13:50:29
Wow, Dr. Bob, that was a really good lesson in I-statements. Thanks for helping.
Posted by alexandra_k on December 23, 2004, at 18:11:52
In reply to Re: Deep breaths (and I-statements) » Dr. Bob, posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 13:58:34
Now I am just being a sh*t, and this really is a joke
but instead of
> Thanks for helping.
How about
I feel helped.
Heh heh. Have a good holiday crushed :-)
PS(I'm not trying to pick on you, nor Dr B either)
Posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 22:28:49
In reply to Re: Deep breaths (and I-statements), posted by alexandra_k on December 23, 2004, at 18:11:52
thanks for the injection of humor, alexandra. :)
Posted by alexandra_k on December 24, 2004, at 1:13:55
In reply to lol » alexandra_k, posted by crushedout on December 23, 2004, at 22:28:49
Thanks for finding it funny
or for at least saying so :-)
I am in a bit of a funny mood...
Posted by gardenergirl on December 27, 2004, at 15:47:57
In reply to Re: lol » crushedout, posted by alexandra_k on December 24, 2004, at 1:13:55
Posted by crushedout on December 27, 2004, at 23:46:47
In reply to Crushed? How are you doing? (nm), posted by gardenergirl on December 27, 2004, at 15:47:57
GG, you are really nice for asking.i'm still struggling a lot with depression and missing the T (not sure whether those two things are connected or just compounding one another) but things are a little better. i think i may desperately need a med adjustment but am too depressed to deal with the pdocs. i've called a few and i really don't like them.
i had a hard day today, because i saw my mom with whom i have a difficult relationship, and some friends of hers who were giving me a lot of sh*t because they think i'm not living my life the way i should. they think i should be making a lot of money. and one of them was really nasty about it. anyway, on the way home, i ran into this guy i dated briefly on the subway, and he missed his stop and then we ended up hanging out and kissing and it was kind of really nice. he gave me a massage and he was a really good kisser. and he gave me some ideas about meds i could try. (he's been struggling with similar stuff lately and has found something that was really helpful -- lamictal -- but i don't want to get redirected to the med board.)
oh geez, am i manic? this post seems manic. i don't want to find out that i'm bipolar on top of everything else.
:)
crushed
Posted by fallsfall on December 28, 2004, at 7:48:55
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing? » gardenergirl, posted by crushedout on December 27, 2004, at 23:46:47
No, you don't sound manic to me.
I'm glad you connected with someone who could help normalize your experiences. You sound pretty lonely to me, though. Post often. I'm here.
Posted by crushedout on December 28, 2004, at 10:19:43
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing? » crushedout, posted by fallsfall on December 28, 2004, at 7:48:55
Thanks, falls. I guess I am really lonely. :(
Posted by Annierose on December 28, 2004, at 20:18:06
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing? » fallsfall, posted by crushedout on December 28, 2004, at 10:19:43
Crushed - So sorry to hear how rough these past few weeks have been for you. Is T2 on vacation, or when is your next appointment? It doesn't feel good to be alone in this mess, but we are here for you. Hasn't it been 2 months without T1? That's a long time. Thinking of you - Annierose
Posted by crushedout on December 29, 2004, at 11:16:17
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing?, posted by Annierose on December 28, 2004, at 20:18:06
Thanks, Annierose. Yes, T2 is on vacation. I see her again on Monday. Yep it's been two months without T1. It is a long time.
> Crushed - So sorry to hear how rough these past few weeks have been for you. Is T2 on vacation, or when is your next appointment? It doesn't feel good to be alone in this mess, but we are here for you. Hasn't it been 2 months without T1? That's a long time. Thinking of you - Annierose
Posted by Annierose on December 29, 2004, at 16:15:54
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing? » Annierose, posted by crushedout on December 29, 2004, at 11:16:17
But you ARE doing this. I hope you find the strength to continue. I know how hard it is! I left my T after 4+ years in mid-session and never returned until now ... 15 years later. I do remember how painful it was at first. But it does get easier. In fact, after I quit therapy, a few months later my husband left me for another woman. So I guess the pain from therapy was replaced with another kind of loss. Boy am I glad he left me. What was I thinking?
Posted by crushedout on December 29, 2004, at 16:23:36
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing?, posted by Annierose on December 29, 2004, at 16:15:54
wait, you mean 15 years later you've gone back to your OLD shrink? the one you left? i'm confused.and was your marriage bad? did you ever remarry?
Posted by annierose on December 29, 2004, at 22:35:49
In reply to Re: Crushed? How are you doing? » Annierose, posted by crushedout on December 29, 2004, at 16:23:36
Yes, yes and yes.
Yes, I went back to my first T after 15 years.
I was so curious to see how we both turned out, so to speak. I was just out of college when I started seeing her, and she was working on her PhD at the time. We really both look the same, just older. She still holds firm boundaries, but is more relaxed and talkative as a T. She had sent me a Christmas card last year, totally out of the blue! Freaked me out. I had sent her holiday cards time to time (especially if I had a photo of my kids on them), but she NEVER EVER responded, even after I walked out mid-session. So the card was "what the heckers!". So I called her and made an appointment last January. I thought I would just wrap things up with her, and then, next thing I know, I'm in this family battle
(my parents) and a legal battle. So I was so glad to have her support throughout the year.Yes, my first husband left me after only a 15 month marriage. I refer to it as my "starter marriage". No kids with him, thankfully. And yes, I remarried 3 years later to my current husband, we have 2 kids (11 and 6).
See, one never knows the curve balls life is going to throw your way. I am so glad I am back in treatment with my T1. But I am extremely thankful, I waited. We grew.
Posted by crushedout on December 30, 2004, at 8:36:30
In reply to Re: YES! » crushedout, posted by annierose on December 29, 2004, at 22:35:49
*why* did you walk out midsession? (maybe you told me and i forgot.)(this is a crazy story.)
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