![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]Shown: posts 29 to 53 of 191. Go back in thread:
Posted by shadows721 on September 3, 2003, at 2:09:24
In reply to The Term Addiction Shouldn't be Taken Lightly. » shadows721, posted by HIBA on September 2, 2003, at 0:25:04
It appears that my words that were taken from a neurologist affended many of you. I did not mean to in anyway. I wanted to help others from not going through withdrawals that included hallucinations, tremors, convulsions, itching, pain, and nausea (to name a few things that actually happened to me). I did not want to cause any arguments to cross between me or others about wording. I did not want to get into any analyzing of terminology, analyzing of medications, or political correctness.
I am just a person that suffers from complex PTSD. I was not born depressed and anxious, I became this way as a very young child. I have been trying to function. I have been on nearly all the medications listed in this discussion with the exception of viagra. I have had withdrawals and bizarre side effects with many of them. So, I send out prayers for all to find the right medication, physician, therapist, and treatments to help them function.
I just don't feel that my words made any sense and my original point was blurred in some way. I just wanted everyone to know that I really care and do not want others to suffer like I have. I'm sorry that I posted.
Thank you to all that have responded. I send everyone love and healing thoughts.
Posted by cubbybear on September 4, 2003, at 0:32:24
In reply to Sorry I posted, posted by shadows721 on September 3, 2003, at 2:09:24
Please do not feel sorry that you posted. I think that many people have learned a lot from your experiences and truly understand what you've been through. It's very common for words to be misconstrued, whether it's via E-mail, message boards, air mail letters, or even person-to-person speech. Misunderstandings happen all the time, and the main thing is that everyone gets to learn what is really meant, and that the misunderstanding gets resolved. I think I can speak for everyone on this board when I say that we wish you well and hope that you will continue to post whenever you feel the need. Unfortunately, there are negative elements in our society and loaded words in our language--words like "addiction" and "co-dependence", that are emotionally charged. The doctors and the media distort and misuse these words and so they get to be used like bullets for shooting people down. The area of benzodiazepines is highly controversial and that only adds to the problem.
So, again, it is my hope that you will continue to post and understand that no one here means any harm to you.
Personally, I am curious about your PTSD, how it happened (if you care to discuss it) and what medications were of help in any way. I do not suffer from this problem but I do know that millions of people in New York City have been traumatized by the events of 9/11 and need to be treated for PTSD as a result. I saw what the Vietnam War did to many soldiers who were lucky (?) enough to make it home and live their lives tormented by the visions of atrocities that occurred on the front lines. So long as the human race remains vulnerable to accidents, wars, bombings, violent deaths, and other traumas, we will have to deal with the after-effects. I believe that one of the most important things victims can do to ease their suffering is just to go on "venting" and talk about their feelings to sympathetic friends.
Posted by shadows721 on September 4, 2003, at 19:33:14
In reply to Re: Sorry I posted » shadows721, posted by cubbybear on September 4, 2003, at 0:32:24
I do appreciate interest cubby. I will try to explain my ailment (complex PTSD). Sorry this is so long.
I was sadistically abused in every means of the word by a very violent and psychotic relative. I had all the signs and symptoms of trauma as a child, but they went unnoticed by the family. This was due to I was such an obedient quiet child. I blocked out this person and his helpers of crime totally. (My MD as a child did not report the physical signs of abuse. I tried as an adult to get a copy of my chart after reading it and the next week my chart was unexplainably destroyed. The doctor died a 2 yrs later.)
My big problems began right after marriage - 3 months. This is typical. However, my symptoms were far from typical. I was having an internal sensation of extreme shaking and my vision changed. MD's were perplexed with my symptoms. I went for several years without the correct dx. I went thru the gambit of medications to try and treat these odd symptoms. Some of the initial meds included Buspar, tranxene, antivert, and a beta-blocker. The odd violent sensations and visual disturbances continued. The depression and anxiety were out of control. I did not even recognize my spouse at times. I was checked out by the best MD's in my area. They put me through every test known. Nothing showed up and the depression sank deeper.
One neurologist noted I had tremors and quickly put me on Klonopin. Klonopin worked like a bullet as far as calming the anxiety. It calmed it so much that I did not deal with the beast that lurked in the closet of my mind. After years of being on the drug, I built a tolerance and the beast of the past started playing Hell with my life again. The doctor immediately put me on Zoloft. I had a violent reaction of vomiting to it and that's when his partner took me off of it just to see what would happen. Oh, my God - the withdrawal was the worst thing that happened to me. When the doc saw what happened he called different drugs in to help- nortriptyline & elavil. I took myself (with research) in tapering off the Klonopin. (I do not recommend doing this alone. I did it, because my physican was not knowledgeable with PTSD and Klonopin withdrawal.)
The beast did not come out of the closet fully until I had a relaxation session with a therapist. My life as trying to become a nurse exploded and I decided to hospitalize myself. My therapist said she had not dealt with this level of abuse.
I got myself through a BSN nursing school with withdrawals and flashbacks and numberous other medication failures (like Serzone, paxil & Prozac, to name a few). No one knew what I was dealing with internally. Complex PTSD affected every aspect of my life - spirituality, sexually, mentally, physically, and emotionally. No one sees what I deal with, because I supposedly look great on the outside. The only thing they see is odd tremors.
My life is still in limbo. Ten years later, I still have body memories, auditory and visual memories almost all the time. They are very fragmented so it makes it really difficult to put together. I am currently trying Buspar (again) & neurontin. Buspar is hard to adjust to, but the family says they see a difference in me. I am in therapy and group therapy. I journal daily, do artwork, and exercise. (By the way, exercise and vitamins did not help the anxiety go away either.) I've read almost every book available on the subject, but my odd symptoms are not in them and they rage on...
Again, I have a MD unfamiliar with dissociation disorder and PTSD. I told him that I hear voices inside. He said that's a psychiatric red flag. I said that I know that I am not schizophrenic. He agreed and said how well I look. I did not go in to detail of the things I hear after that. This MD gives you 15mins to talk. It's just to see how the meds work.
I have tried acupuncture too. It works temporarily with the anxiety/depression, but it's very expensive. It is also very triggering to me, because part of my trauma was being bit repeatedly by snakes owned by the perp.
I am about to throw in the towel on nursing, because my problems are hindering me. I am more like a patient than a nurse. Do not feel that I can help others when I am in so much pain. Also, I am about to try EEG biofeedback as another method of treatment.
I am just an ordinary person that has experienced extremely unordinary abuse. I seek peace within and have been in contact with someone that helps people with spirtuality. All I have done is educated myself extensively and tried every method available to help me deal with the war no one talks about out loud. Complex PTSD is like being in war, but you do not remember who you were at war with or where it took place. The soldier within marches on inside without being noticed in the outside world.
Peace to all.
Shadows
Posted by Adia on September 4, 2003, at 22:46:50
In reply to The shadows from the past (complex PTSD), posted by shadows721 on September 4, 2003, at 19:33:14
Hi,
I just wanted to say you are not alone...
and send you my support...not sure I can help..
but I suffer from the same, as a result of severe sexual abuse (incest)...
I struggle with the things you've shared and right now I feel I wouldn't be here if it weren't for my therapist ...I'm taking Risperdal but about to change..It is very scary and painful to walk through this healing journey and the aftermath of abuse all alone.
I just wanted to reach out and say you are not alone.
Is there anything I could do to help you?
Let me know...
lots of support and healing thoughts,
Adia.> I do appreciate interest cubby. I will try to explain my ailment (complex PTSD). Sorry this is so long.
>
> I was sadistically abused in every means of the word by a very violent and psychotic relative. I had all the signs and symptoms of trauma as a child, but they went unnoticed by the family. This was due to I was such an obedient quiet child. I blocked out this person and his helpers of crime totally. (My MD as a child did not report the physical signs of abuse. I tried as an adult to get a copy of my chart after reading it and the next week my chart was unexplainably destroyed. The doctor died a 2 yrs later.)
>
> My big problems began right after marriage - 3 months. This is typical. However, my symptoms were far from typical. I was having an internal sensation of extreme shaking and my vision changed. MD's were perplexed with my symptoms. I went for several years without the correct dx. I went thru the gambit of medications to try and treat these odd symptoms. Some of the initial meds included Buspar, tranxene, antivert, and a beta-blocker. The odd violent sensations and visual disturbances continued. The depression and anxiety were out of control. I did not even recognize my spouse at times. I was checked out by the best MD's in my area. They put me through every test known. Nothing showed up and the depression sank deeper.
>
> One neurologist noted I had tremors and quickly put me on Klonopin. Klonopin worked like a bullet as far as calming the anxiety. It calmed it so much that I did not deal with the beast that lurked in the closet of my mind. After years of being on the drug, I built a tolerance and the beast of the past started playing Hell with my life again. The doctor immediately put me on Zoloft. I had a violent reaction of vomiting to it and that's when his partner took me off of it just to see what would happen. Oh, my God - the withdrawal was the worst thing that happened to me. When the doc saw what happened he called different drugs in to help- nortriptyline & elavil. I took myself (with research) in tapering off the Klonopin. (I do not recommend doing this alone. I did it, because my physican was not knowledgeable with PTSD and Klonopin withdrawal.)
>
> The beast did not come out of the closet fully until I had a relaxation session with a therapist. My life as trying to become a nurse exploded and I decided to hospitalize myself. My therapist said she had not dealt with this level of abuse.
>
> I got myself through a BSN nursing school with withdrawals and flashbacks and numberous other medication failures (like Serzone, paxil & Prozac, to name a few). No one knew what I was dealing with internally. Complex PTSD affected every aspect of my life - spirituality, sexually, mentally, physically, and emotionally. No one sees what I deal with, because I supposedly look great on the outside. The only thing they see is odd tremors.
>
> My life is still in limbo. Ten years later, I still have body memories, auditory and visual memories almost all the time. They are very fragmented so it makes it really difficult to put together. I am currently trying Buspar (again) & neurontin. Buspar is hard to adjust to, but the family says they see a difference in me. I am in therapy and group therapy. I journal daily, do artwork, and exercise. (By the way, exercise and vitamins did not help the anxiety go away either.) I've read almost every book available on the subject, but my odd symptoms are not in them and they rage on...
>
> Again, I have a MD unfamiliar with dissociation disorder and PTSD. I told him that I hear voices inside. He said that's a psychiatric red flag. I said that I know that I am not schizophrenic. He agreed and said how well I look. I did not go in to detail of the things I hear after that. This MD gives you 15mins to talk. It's just to see how the meds work.
>
> I have tried acupuncture too. It works temporarily with the anxiety/depression, but it's very expensive. It is also very triggering to me, because part of my trauma was being bit repeatedly by snakes owned by the perp.
>
> I am about to throw in the towel on nursing, because my problems are hindering me. I am more like a patient than a nurse. Do not feel that I can help others when I am in so much pain. Also, I am about to try EEG biofeedback as another method of treatment.
>
> I am just an ordinary person that has experienced extremely unordinary abuse. I seek peace within and have been in contact with someone that helps people with spirtuality. All I have done is educated myself extensively and tried every method available to help me deal with the war no one talks about out loud. Complex PTSD is like being in war, but you do not remember who you were at war with or where it took place. The soldier within marches on inside without being noticed in the outside world.
>
> Peace to all.
>
> Shadows
>
>
>
>
Posted by shadows721 on September 4, 2003, at 23:29:03
In reply to Re: The shadows from the past (complex PTSD) » shadows721, posted by Adia on September 4, 2003, at 22:46:50
Thank you so much Adia. It was painful to write all that out. A part of me really wants to help people understand the world I live in and let others like me know they are not crazy. What they went through was crazy. I did not develop these odd symptoms and extreme fears/depression for no reason.
I have been through 3 therapists, before I found the right one. She has no experience with repressed memories, but that does not matter to me. What matters is that she shows more compassion and concern than any I have met.
I am so glad you have help. The doc offered Seroquel to me to help me sleep. He said at low doses this med is very helpful for sleeping and may help my hypervigiliance. I see things move in the corner of my sight all the time. I find I tend to self rock a lot too when under great stress. I am extremely jumpy with sounds or touch. Just can not handle watching much of what is on tv either. These are just some of the aftermath of trauma for me.
Shadows
Posted by cubbybear on September 5, 2003, at 6:15:57
In reply to The shadows from the past (complex PTSD), posted by shadows721 on September 4, 2003, at 19:33:14
Hi Shadows,
I didn't think you'd be willing to disclose your past trauma on this board and so I found your post very moving. I'm nearly at a loss for words, but there are a couple of things I'd like to say. One is that I'm presently tapering off Klonopin myself. Although I need a doctor's prescription to obtain it (here in Thailand as in the U.S.), my pdoc is an uninspiring cold fish and not really supportive of the idea of my quitting the Klonopin. He'll come out with remarks like "Just remember that if you have any problems sleeping, 2 mg. per day is perfectly safe and you shouldn't worry about it." Yes of course. But the fact is that I *want* to discontinue the medication and have resorted to my own tapering guidelines. He's never given me a tapering schedule. I've figured it out solely with the help of numerous posts on this board from others who have tapered off Klonopin.As for PTSD, all I can say is that there's a fabulous book (not sure if it's still in print) called "They Cage the Animals at Night" by Jennings Michael Burch, who narrates his experiences of being physically abused as a child. I don't know if you're into reading about others' experiences, but it's a heart-rending book. (I'm supposed to say something here about double-double quotes when recommending a book, but am not sure what Dr. Bob means by this. He'll probably jump into the discussion and tell me. . .) Anyway, you might want to read the book. Keep posting and talking to us.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 5, 2003, at 8:41:28
In reply to After shocks of trauma, posted by shadows721 on September 4, 2003, at 23:29:03
> Thank you so much Adia. It was painful to write all that out.
I hope it was a little bit cathartic, to express yourself that way.
> A part of me really wants to help people understand the world I live in and let others like me know they are not crazy. What they went through was crazy. I did not develop these odd symptoms and extreme fears/depression for no reason.
Absolutely not. I don't pretend that I know how you feel, as the depth of your wounds seems severe, but I too have PTSD from childhood abuse. I don't mean to sound in any way that I'm trivializing your efforts at recovery, because I'm not....your body has learned to respond the way it does, and there may be ways to retrain it. Have you tried EMDR?
> I have been through 3 therapists, before I found the right one. She has no experience with repressed memories, but that does not matter to me. What matters is that she shows more compassion and concern than any I have met.There are trauma-specialist therapists.
> I am so glad you have help. The doc offered Seroquel to me to help me sleep. He said at low doses this med is very helpful for sleeping and may help my hypervigiliance. I see things move in the corner of my sight all the time. I find I tend to self rock a lot too when under great stress. I am extremely jumpy with sounds or touch.I know you said that vitamins didn't help you, but there are nutritional aspects to hypervigilance. The unfortunate truth about that is that it will require some experimentation, and is a prolonged process. Your body didn't become disrupted the way it is, all in one day. It takes time to nudge it back towards more natural functioning.
> Just can not handle watching much of what is on tv either. These are just some of the aftermath of trauma for me.
>
>
> ShadowsI admire your courage, very much.
Lar
Posted by shadows721 on September 5, 2003, at 22:14:37
In reply to Re: The shadows from the past (complex PTSD) » shadows721, posted by cubbybear on September 5, 2003, at 6:15:57
Thanks for you so much for the kind words.
As you know, it is possible to taper save. Go with what your body tells you. I had to use a pill cutter to help me. I took 3 years, but I went extremly slow. Kava Kava helped me a great deal too. I know they say it isn't safe, but I used it to just temporarily hold me over. Also, I used an antidepressant to help me through it too.
Thanks for the tip on the book. I will check it out. I really do read just about every one I can get my hands on.
shadows
Posted by shadows721 on September 5, 2003, at 22:44:12
In reply to Re: After shocks of trauma » shadows721, posted by Larry Hoover on September 5, 2003, at 8:41:28
Hi there Larry
Yes, you are so right about this condition. I did not know about the vitamins helping hyperviligance. Which ones help? Currently, I take B's, calcium, magnesium, and C.
I did try EMDR. Most I have spoken to got their memories with this. I did not. I got a look at the parts of self that felt shattered. At 1st, I did not understand the visuals I was given, but now I am really starting to understand. The pieces are hard to put together. It seems like it has taken me years to piece things together.
Now, I am talking to a specialist about trying EEG biofeedback. Have you tried this treatment? Haven't spoken to anyone that has benefited from it.
The other therapist that I went to were experts in the field of DID and PTSD. I do not know why I just did not work with them well at all. I have never figured it out. Perhaps, it was a personality issue.
Buspar is helping me now. I was in horrible shape. I was shaking and feel electricity going thru my limbs from nerves. The buspar was hard to adjust to. It made me very dizzy and almost felt pressure in my head. The neurontin works well with it.
I never thought I was depressed - just anxious. But, I did feel like I was literally going to die, because I felt so bad - felt like weights hung all over me. I did not realize that my depression was really affecting my vision among other things. Now, everything is crystal clear. The buspar has not made me have the typical SSRI symptoms either. It took about 6 weeks to really start helping me. I am on the max dose 60 mg. My family can tell when I haven't taken my medication. They tell me, "Oh, by the way, did you take your medication?"
Thanks for writting.
Shadows.
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 6, 2003, at 9:04:27
In reply to Re: After shocks of trauma, posted by shadows721 on September 5, 2003, at 22:44:12
> Hi there Larry
>
> Yes, you are so right about this condition. I did not know about the vitamins helping hyperviligance. Which ones help? Currently, I take B's, calcium, magnesium, and C.How much magnesium? You may need substantial supplementation of mag, as prolonged stress causes magnesium to be dumped into urine. You need D3, to ensure uptake.
The B's are certainly important, but they may be of limited effect without concurrent mineral supps, particularly zinc(40 mg/day) and selenium (200 mcg/day). Both are hammered hard by chronic stress. And, niacinamide (the amide of nicotinic acid, B3), has calming effects all on its own.
One of the outcomes of the chronic stress condition is oxidative stress, which has substantial adverse effects. Vitamin C helps, but it's water soluble (2,000 mg/day). You need some vitamin E (800 IU/day) for fat-soluble protection, and alphalipoic acid (protects both lipids and aqueous environments, and helps extend the useful lifetime of both C and E).
The targets of oxidative stress include membrane phospholipids, and their fatty acid adducts. There are four major phospholipids, and three of them are found in good quantities in soya lecithin. I just eat soya lecithin granules by the spoonful. The missing one, phosphatidylserine, is the most critical one, as it is not only a membrane constituent, it is also a modulator of HPA activity. The supplemental form is man-made from soya lecithin, so it's substantially more expensive than the others, but it really helps with the startle thingie.
The other thing is the long-chain omega-3 fatty acids. They are bound to the phospholipids, so supplying them at the same time will probably encourage their incorporation into membranes. DHA, one of those omega-3's, helps dampen adrenal stimulation, quite apart from its actions in membranes.
Methyl donors may also have long-term calming capacity. That would be B-12, and TMG (trimethylglycine).
It may sound like a lot, but I have normalized my own startle response. I have a vulnerability (when I get stressed, I can feel it sneeking back in), but hitting the supps gets me back on track. I'm lazy with my supp intake some times, but that's probably because I'm doing so much better (I was totally disabled) that I get too busy, and I forget.
The supps may provide some immediate relief, but more likely, over the long term, your stress tolerance and reactivity will tend to normalize.
There are also herbs that directly downregulate the hyper-reactive HPA axis. Siberian ginseng, Ginkgo biloba. Licorice root tricks the hypothalamus into thinking the adrenals are working up to capacity, and can allow them to rest. St. John's wort can be helpful. I'm not suggesting you try these with the drugs. I'm saying there are options.
> I did try EMDR. Most I have spoken to got their memories with this. I did not. I got a look at the parts of self that felt shattered. At 1st, I did not understand the visuals I was given, but now I am really starting to understand. The pieces are hard to put together. It seems like it has taken me years to piece things together.
I understand that "putting the pieces together" thingie. It was "too much to take" back then, and I stored bits and pieces of the memories all over the place. Maybe you'll find EMDR more useful in the future, if you can start to bring together some memories via other means.
> Now, I am talking to a specialist about trying EEG biofeedback. Have you tried this treatment? Haven't spoken to anyone that has benefited from it.No, I haven't tried it. The only one I ever knew who used it was able to control chronic neuropathic pain with it. It can be a powerful tool. I'd certainly be interested in hearing about how it works for you (or not).
> The other therapist that I went to were experts in the field of DID and PTSD. I do not know why I just did not work with them well at all. I have never figured it out. Perhaps, it was a personality issue.That's always a critical factor. It's all about set and setting. That's mindset and environment during the sessions. How these therapists work might not have been right for you.
> Buspar is helping me now. I was in horrible shape. I was shaking and feel electricity going thru my limbs from nerves. The buspar was hard to adjust to. It made me very dizzy and almost felt pressure in my head. The neurontin works well with it.
> I never thought I was depressed - just anxious. But, I did feel like I was literally going to die, because I felt so bad - felt like weights hung all over me.I was diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome long before I grasped the idea that I had PTSD. One of the critical supplements for me, with respect to both PTSD and CFS, has been NADH. It's a metabolite of niacin, but the synthesis of it may be hugely disrupted in both conditions. The result is abnormal energy production in mitochondria, throughout the body. Everythings affected. It has been a miraculous supplement for me. Enada NADH. Enada is an Austrian corporation that produces the stabilized NADH, but it is marketed by a variety of companies. It's all the same stuff.
> I did not realize that my depression was really affecting my vision among other things. Now, everything is crystal clear. The buspar has not made me have the typical SSRI symptoms either. It took about 6 weeks to really start helping me. I am on the max dose 60 mg. My family can tell when I haven't taken my medication. They tell me, "Oh, by the way, did you take your medication?"
Feedback helps. I take support wherever I can find it.
> Thanks for writting.
>
> Shadows.
Posted by shadows721 on September 6, 2003, at 11:38:45
In reply to Re: After shocks of trauma » shadows721, posted by Larry Hoover on September 6, 2003, at 9:04:27
Wow! You are so informative. I had no idea about the supplements. Thank so much.
I hope you are doing okay with the chronic fatigue syndrome. I have often wondered if I had it or was it the depression. Sometimes, I feel like my mind is shutting down. Someone told me it was the system and it worked well in the past, but now it's being taken apart to heal. Oh, this healing process is really hard on my life.
Wish you well.
shadows
Posted by Larry Hoover on September 7, 2003, at 11:05:37
In reply to to larry, posted by shadows721 on September 6, 2003, at 11:38:45
> Wow! You are so informative. I had no idea about the supplements. Thank so much.
You're welcome.
Your body can get locked into negative-feedback loops, which is another way of saying that it's lost the ability to restore homeostasis. One example is insulin resistance. If you can figure out what to feed your body, you can nudge it back towards homeostasis. Often, that requires dosing that is "off the charts" with respect to concepts like RDA. We're not talking physiological dose any more, we're into therapeutic dosing.
At least in part, PTSD involves the amygdala, part of the primitive, subconscious stimulus-processing brain region. Phobias probably arise there. When you have PTSD, you have a psychological reaction to a physiological process. You can learn how to intervene.
> I hope you are doing okay with the chronic fatigue syndrome.
Reasonably well, thanks. I'm not well, but I'm certainly much better. I am absolutely thrilled with what I can accomplish now. The problem is, it is so easy to get distracted, and forget about my self-care.
>I have often wondered if I had it or was it the depression.
Although diagnostic definitions are useful, I prefer to think in clusters of associated disorders. Within the cluster, the lines blur.
For example, I have had diagnoses of acute PTSD, chronic PTSD, chronic fatigue, major depression, dysthymia (my "normal", in the absence of depression), irritable bowel syndrome, gastro-esophageal reflux disorder, insomnia, and a joint disorder (not specified, but involving serious arthralgia). In my mind, they're all manifestations of one broad disorder (the cluster). I don't much care what it's called, ya know? A large number of my symptoms, cutting across the various diagnoses, vary in intensity together. Not all symptoms, but many of them.
> Sometimes, I feel like my mind is shutting down. Someone told me it was the system and it worked well in the past, but now it's being taken apart to heal.
That's a useful metaphor. I've let go of a number of what I used to think of as traits (defined as uncheangeable aspects of character, but obviously not unchangeable). I've kept what is useful to me, and I'm amazed at what I left behind.
> Oh, this healing process is really hard on my life.
Oh, yeah.
> Wish you well.
>
> shadowsYou, too.
Lar
Posted by CarterS on October 18, 2003, at 14:59:21
In reply to withdrawl from Klonopin, posted by sheebies on August 25, 2003, at 8:54:49
Hey I'm scared of withdrawal from Klonopin. I've been on so many drugs, Prozac, Paxil, Neurontin, etc. Right now I'm taking Lexa-Pro, Klonopin, Gabitril, and Buspar. I want to get off of the Klonopin and want to know what will happen and why.
Posted by lamajama on October 30, 2003, at 11:09:46
In reply to Re: withdrawl from Klonopin » shadows721, posted by HIBA on August 27, 2003, at 0:07:02
Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
Posted by cubbybear on October 30, 2003, at 23:12:29
In reply to New here and sharing a bit, posted by lamajama on October 30, 2003, at 11:09:46
> Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
I am presently weaning myself off from a high of 4 mg. Klonopin last year. Am currently down to .75 mg. and it has taken several months to do it, because I've learned that you must decrease ever so slowly. For me, it's something like decreases of only .125 mg. every 10-14 days. If you try to go faster than your body can tolerate, you'll definitely get withdrawal symptoms, like insomnia, anxiety, and irritability. You should never quit a benzo drug cold turkey.
As far as the Xanax goes, I question why your doctor has put you on a more powerful drug to help with the weaning off process. This sounds completely wrong. The only other benzo that is recommended to help with the Klonopin tapering is Valium.
I suggest you mention this to your doctor. If he/she balks, then get yourself another doctor to help you establish a good tapering schedule.
Posted by cubbybear on October 30, 2003, at 23:12:59
In reply to New here and sharing a bit, posted by lamajama on October 30, 2003, at 11:09:46
> Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
I am presently weaning myself off from a high of 4 mg. Klonopin last year. Am currently down to .75 mg. and it has taken several months to do it, because I've learned that you must decrease ever so slowly. For me, it's something like decreases of only .125 mg. every 10-14 days. If you try to go faster than your body can tolerate, you'll definitely get withdrawal symptoms, like insomnia, anxiety, and irritability. You should never quit a benzo drug cold turkey.
As far as the Xanax goes, I question why your doctor has put you on a more powerful drug to help with the weaning off process. This sounds completely wrong. The only other benzo that is recommended to help with the Klonopin tapering is Valium.
I suggest you mention this to your doctor. If he/she balks, then get yourself another doctor to help you establish a good tapering schedule.
Posted by lamajama on October 31, 2003, at 22:03:21
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit » lamajama, posted by cubbybear on October 30, 2003, at 23:12:59
> > Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
>
> I am presently weaning myself off from a high of 4 mg. Klonopin last year. Am currently down to .75 mg. and it has taken several months to do it, because I've learned that you must decrease ever so slowly. For me, it's something like decreases of only .125 mg. every 10-14 days. If you try to go faster than your body can tolerate, you'll definitely get withdrawal symptoms, like insomnia, anxiety, and irritability. You should never quit a benzo drug cold turkey.
>
> As far as the Xanax goes, I question why your doctor has put you on a more powerful drug to help with the weaning off process. This sounds completely wrong. The only other benzo that is recommended to help with the Klonopin tapering is Valium.
> I suggest you mention this to your doctor. If he/she balks, then get yourself another doctor to help you establish a good tapering schedule.
>Thanks for the imput. I will talk to my doctor about the Xanaz. I haven't taken the Xanax to help with my side-effects. I did however talk to my doctor about cutting my Klonopin dosage in half. It has been too hard on me. I am now taking 1.5mg. It is so troublesome to me that this drug has such a hold on me. I have been trying for a long time to wean off it. I sometimes wonder if I will even be able to cope without it. It is just very frustrating at times. Thanks again for listening. I really do appreciate it.
Posted by RT on November 3, 2003, at 20:02:29
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit » lamajama, posted by lamajama on October 31, 2003, at 22:03:21
> > > Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
> >
> > I am presently weaning myself off from a high of 4 mg. Klonopin last year. Am currently down to .75 mg. and it has taken several months to do it, because I've learned that you must decrease ever so slowly. For me, it's something like decreases of only .125 mg. every 10-14 days. If you try to go faster than your body can tolerate, you'll definitely get withdrawal symptoms, like insomnia, anxiety, and irritability. You should never quit a benzo drug cold turkey.
> >
> > As far as the Xanax goes, I question why your doctor has put you on a more powerful drug to help with the weaning off process. This sounds completely wrong. The only other benzo that is recommended to help with the Klonopin tapering is Valium.
> > I suggest you mention this to your doctor. If he/she balks, then get yourself another doctor to help you establish a good tapering schedule.
> >
>
> Thanks for the imput. I will talk to my doctor about the Xanaz. I haven't taken the Xanax to help with my side-effects. I did however talk to my doctor about cutting my Klonopin dosage in half. It has been too hard on me. I am now taking 1.5mg. It is so troublesome to me that this drug has such a hold on me. I have been trying for a long time to wean off it. I sometimes wonder if I will even be able to cope without it. It is just very frustrating at times. Thanks again for listening. I really do appreciate it.
>
>
I have been on both xanax and klonopin over the years and neither one is easy to get off of to me. I think your doctor is wrong in giving you the xanax to get off the klonopin though. I was given just the opposite. I had always heard xanax was the worst to get off of and the klonopin was used to get off the xanax. you can do it though it may seem like you cant do without them , but it just takes time to ease your way off and the uncomfortable side effects will eventuallly go away , just hang in there.
Posted by lamajama on November 3, 2003, at 20:22:03
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit, posted by RT on November 3, 2003, at 20:02:29
> > > > Hi all. I am new here. I have been taking Klonopin for over 7 years now. I have never gone over 2mg. Over the years I have tried to go off this drug. I went cold turkey the first time and thought I was going to die. Last week I cut my dosage in 1/2. I am not sleeping as well and I am very moody. My doc gave me Xanax to help with the withdrawls. Why give me another addictive drug? I would like to have a baby and I have to go off this medication. I am a bit discouraged because what I have read from everyone is wean yourself slowly. I am just grateful that I have found this site where I can be with other people with the same symptoms as myself.
> > >
> > > I am presently weaning myself off from a high of 4 mg. Klonopin last year. Am currently down to .75 mg. and it has taken several months to do it, because I've learned that you must decrease ever so slowly. For me, it's something like decreases of only .125 mg. every 10-14 days. If you try to go faster than your body can tolerate, you'll definitely get withdrawal symptoms, like insomnia, anxiety, and irritability. You should never quit a benzo drug cold turkey.
> > >
> > > As far as the Xanax goes, I question why your doctor has put you on a more powerful drug to help with the weaning off process. This sounds completely wrong. The only other benzo that is recommended to help with the Klonopin tapering is Valium.
> > > I suggest you mention this to your doctor. If he/she balks, then get yourself another doctor to help you establish a good tapering schedule.
> > >
> >
> > Thanks for the imput. I will talk to my doctor about the Xanaz. I haven't taken the Xanax to help with my side-effects. I did however talk to my doctor about cutting my Klonopin dosage in half. It has been too hard on me. I am now taking 1.5mg. It is so troublesome to me that this drug has such a hold on me. I have been trying for a long time to wean off it. I sometimes wonder if I will even be able to cope without it. It is just very frustrating at times. Thanks again for listening. I really do appreciate it.
> >
> >
> I have been on both xanax and klonopin over the years and neither one is easy to get off of to me. I think your doctor is wrong in giving you the xanax to get off the klonopin though. I was given just the opposite. I had always heard xanax was the worst to get off of and the klonopin was used to get off the xanax. you can do it though it may seem like you cant do without them , but it just takes time to ease your way off and the uncomfortable side effects will eventuallly go away , just hang in there.Thanks for the support. I am struggling with the decrease of the Klonopin. I want so badly to increase my dosage back to 2 mg. I want so badly to get off this medication, but the nervousness I feel is so uncomfortable. The insomnia is starting to affect me as well. I am not going to take the Xanax. The thought of getting addicted to another drug scares me to death. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can do to get through these withdrawal symtoms?
Thanks
>
Posted by cubbybear on November 4, 2003, at 1:56:20
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit, posted by lamajama on November 3, 2003, at 20:22:03
> Thanks for the support. I am struggling with the decrease of the Klonopin. I want so badly to increase my dosage back to 2 mg. I want so badly to get off this medication, but the nervousness I feel is so uncomfortable. The insomnia is starting to affect me as well. I am not going to take the Xanax. The thought of getting addicted to another drug scares me to death. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can do to get through these withdrawal symtoms?
> ThanksI really feel for what you're going through. Some people have a miserable time quitting these meds, while others do not. You made a wise decision not to take the Xanax. If you're determined to succeed, you will. I suggest that you treat yourself kindly and go back to the 2 mg. dose, wait about 1-2 weeks to readjust, then start your taper. Go very slowly. . get a pill cutter and decrease at the rate of about .125 mg. every couple of weeks or so. From 2.0, go to 1.875, then 1.75, then 1.625, etc. As you get toward the end of your taper, to the very low numbers, you can extend the time between decreases. This is the way I've been doing it, after I started getting withdrawal anxiety in the early stages of tapering. Don't be in a hurry to get off. Accept the fact that you'll need to make very small cuts and stay on each new dose for 1-2 weeks or more. There are plenty of postings in the Psychobabble archives from earlier this year from various people. This is where I found Psychobabble to be incredibly useful--in helping me to devise my own tapering schedule rather than go with the doctors, who were either reckless and wanted to rush me through the tapering or didn't give me any reinforcement, support, or pat on the back for doing well with the decreases. This guy would have thought nothing of keeping me on the Klonopin after I stated emphatically that I wanted to get off it. Sometimes it's best to take matters into your own hands, even if you have to backtrack a little at first.
> >
>
>
Posted by lamajama on November 4, 2003, at 12:23:19
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit » lamajama, posted by cubbybear on November 4, 2003, at 1:56:20
Thanks for your advice. I talked to my doctor and she suggested putting me on Clonodin (blood pressure med) to help curb the withdrawals. I think she is nuts. It is time to find another doctor. I have been trying to go off the Klonopin for years now. The end result was going back to the 2 mg. I had found that I would do alright for awhile, then I would start feeling anxious. I feel like a total failure. I feel like I am just setting myself up for another failed attempt to go off Klonopin. Wrong attitude I know. It just gets so draining. Thanks for listening.
Posted by RT on November 4, 2003, at 19:59:04
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit » lamajama, posted by lamajama on November 4, 2003, at 12:23:19
> Thanks for your advice. I talked to my doctor and she suggested putting me on Clonodin (blood pressure med) to help curb the withdrawals. I think she is nuts. It is time to find another doctor. I have been trying to go off the Klonopin for years now. The end result was going back to the 2 mg. I had found that I would do alright for awhile, then I would start feeling anxious. I feel like a total failure. I feel like I am just setting myself up for another failed attempt to go off Klonopin. Wrong attitude I know. It just gets so draining. Thanks for listening.
Clonidine is a blood pressure medication, I think its an alpha adrenergic blocker , I have also taken this medication and I wouldnt suggest you start on it. I had a hard time coming off it also. it can cause rebound hypertesion, it caused me to have heart palpatations, it would be something you would have to ween off of again. Maybe neurontin might work its very sedating to me and I think its not addicting , I had no trouble getting off it. An antidepressant would work for your anxiety or maybe buspar might be worth checking out. Good luck and hang in there
Posted by maximum on November 14, 2003, at 19:17:03
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit, posted by RT on November 4, 2003, at 19:59:04
Quick question for anyone out there... I've been taking Klonopin for about 3 or 4 months and I'm scared to death of becoming dependent on it. Do you all think that I'm in danger of withdrawal after this short amount of time?
Posted by cubbybear on November 15, 2003, at 0:05:13
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit, posted by maximum on November 14, 2003, at 19:17:03
> Quick question for anyone out there... I've been taking Klonopin for about 3 or 4 months and I'm scared to death of becoming dependent on it. Do you all think that I'm in danger of withdrawal after this short amount of time?
Physical and/or psychological dependency on benzodiazepines can develop after as little as 2 weeks. That's just the way it is. Don't worry about this, since when it is time for you to quit, you will reduce your dosage gradually and that should minimize any discomfort from the decrease. I'm curious about what your dosage is right now anyway.
Posted by maximum on November 16, 2003, at 17:42:13
In reply to Re: New here and sharing a bit » maximum, posted by cubbybear on November 15, 2003, at 0:05:13
Hey, my current dosage is 1mg. three times a day. Is that a normal sounding prescription to you?
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
[email protected]
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.